Cheapo monosteels

[labor of love]

Masahiro profile looks very sweet. Anyone know asymmetrical they are?

 

[Benuser]

Very asymmetric with the few I've sharpened. Hope to tell you more when I get one in use one of these days.

 

[pavel]

Pavel
Out of curiosity ran "masamoto 13012 rakuten" on the internet. Got 4 or 5 replies from Rakuten shops. The low quote was from onr named MANMARU at $72.77.

Pavel

 

[labor of love]

+1 for Masahiro. Love mine. It's a great work knife. Great price, profile, and steel. Not flashy at all.

It's interesting that the rivets in this masa are normal but the ones at knife merchant are brass(?)

https://www.knifemerchant.com/product.asp?productID=5874

 

[supersayan3]

Brass rivets, extra stamp, everything for you, the lefties...

Left side is hollow

 

[supersayan3]

Left side is hollow on the right hand one, sorry for any confusion

 

[Bromo33333]

I don't have a great deal of experience with the breadth of knives that most here do, but I have had a good experience in the last few weeks with my Yaxell Dragon.

It's an American steel that has a HRC of about 63 or so, monosteel, takes a sharp edge, and is supposed to be tough and durable. It's balance and lightness reminds me of my Shuns more than my Wusthofs aor Zwilling knives. Shape is closer to the German ideals (the 8" like a fat belly German style, the 10" is closer to a Gyuto or French knife - it's lighter than my 8" Zwilling Pro-S Chef)

You can find the 8" from about $70-120 depending where you look. It has a belly and is an excellent rocker. It's OK for chopping but excels as a rocker.
The 10" one can be had from $90-140 depending upon who is selling it, and it has a long flat part to the blade so both rocks and chops and slices well - it may be my favorite knife of the two.

It seems to combine American, German and Japanese sensibilities in one knife so it's not a Gyuto, nor is it really a "German" knife. But if someone preps like a Westerner, and wants to learn other prep techniques, the 10" might be a great choice.

Just something to consider. Since the Chef Knives can be had fairly inexpensively right now -

 

[Benuser]

https://www.knifemerchant.com/images/products/DRGN-CHEF-1000.jpg

Very high tip, typical of modern Germans.

 

[Bromo33333]

https://www.knifemerchant.com/images/products/DRGN-CHEF-1000.jpg

Very high tip, typical of modern Germans.

Go figure. Slices a lot like my Shun Gyuto-like Kiritsuke. As I said, I don't have the breadth of experience like most here.

 

[Benuser]

Left side is hollow on the right hand one, sorry for any confusion

Really, hollow, concave, not simply flat? Are you sure?

 

[panda]

ive tried masahiro carbon and it is way too asymmetric even for me (i like highly asymmetric) because it is 95/5, completely flat on the left face, i didnt notice any concavity.

 

[Benuser]

Thanks, Panda. Was my impression as well. Will soon report about my own findings.

 

[supersayan3]

Hi Benuser!

Absolutely.
I drag the left side flat on the stones every time in a sharpening session, and only the spine and the edge touch, you see the marks.
Exactly the same grind, has the stainless 148... line, but thinner and the gyuto 21cm taller than the carbon.

My favourite grind on knives, as much as I have experienced so far.
Wish I had more expensive blades with this grind.
And the steel... amazing

 

[labor of love]

Hi Benuser!

Absolutely.
I drag the left side flat on the stones every time in a sharpening session, and only the spine and the edge touch, you see the marks.
Exactly the same grind, has the stainless 148... line, but thinner and the gyuto 21cm taller than the carbon.

My favourite grind on knives, as much as I have experienced so far.
Wish I had more expensive blades with this grind.
And the steel... amazing

Are you referring to the 240mm extra tall gyuto/santoku? Masahiro?

 

[Benuser]

Hi Benuser!

Absolutely.
I drag the left side flat on the stones every time in a sharpening session, and only the spine and the edge touch, you see the marks.
Exactly the same grind, has the stainless 148... line, but thinner and the gyuto 21cm taller than the carbon.

My favourite grind on knives, as much as I have experienced so far.
Wish I had more expensive blades with this grind.
And the steel... amazing

Thanks!

 

[supersayan3]

Νο, I don't have any santoku. The 21-24gyutos, 131... + 148... Lines.
The flexible 20 cm sujihiki (which is flexible, but only half compared to Victorinox, but better profile), from 149... line,
Is flat, not hollow, but this must be applying only to 2-3 knives of just that line to be flat.

I will check, first chance the 30cm Carbon sujihiki from the 131.. Line and update

 

[supersayan3]

ive tried masahiro carbon and it is way too asymmetric even for me (i like highly asymmetric) because it is 95/5, completely flat on the left face, i didnt notice any concavity.

Maybe they changed it?
Try dragging flat the left side on a stone

 

[Danzo]

That profile on the yaxell looks hard to use. (Euro)

I'm gonna get my hands on this masahiro soon too I think. I'll report

 

[mattador]

Resurrection bump..... buuut any news on that masahiro? I'm looking into cheapish monosteel carbons for fun and am deciding on masahiro or sakai kikumori

 

[Lpn562]

+1 on the Masahiro!

 

[Danzo]

Masahiro is great. Comparing it to a misono(210). Better edge retention. Better distal taper, decent for a stamped knife. Less reactive steel. One thing I didn’t like was the original grind, steered like crazy but after a couple sharpenings it levels out. F&F is rough like the rest of the knives in this category but that’s an easy fix.

Masahiro is the spalted maple one with the broken tip

Excuse the tape

 

[mattador]

Masahiro is great. Comparing it to a misono(210). Better edge retention. Better distal taper, decent for a stamped knife. Less reactive steel. One thing I didn’t like was the original grind, steered like crazy but after a couple sharpenings it levels out. F&F is rough like the rest of the knives in this category but that’s an easy fix.

Masahiro is the spalted maple one with the broken tip

Excuse the tape

Right on, thanks for the update! I don’t mind doing some work so I’ll be looking forward to tweaking the grind. This pretty much seals the deal for me and I’ll be grabbing some soon!

 

[panda]

danzo what are all the knives in that pic?

as far as western monos, i think misono moly is best bang/buck, sweet profile and pretty thin grind. i prefer yoshihiro ginsan-ko only because of the steel and it's more beefy (more comfortable using as a don't give af knife).

 

[Xenif]

I find a lot of love for Misono for both stainless and Carbon around here, much less for Masahiro. Is it mainly the grind, the steel, f&f?

 

[labor of love]

I find a lot of love for Misono for both stainless and Carbon around here, much less for Masahiro. Is it mainly the grind, the steel, f&f?

Honestly I think just a lot more people have used misono, not as many have tried masahiro.

 

[daddy yo yo]

If i were in the market for an affordable monosteel knife it would be either Misono Dragon, Suien VC (from JKI), or that Masahiro. I own the Dragon and love it. I still want to try the other 2...

 

[Benuser]

I find a lot of love for Misono for both stainless and Carbon around here, much less for Masahiro. Is it mainly the grind, the steel, f&f?

The Misonos are far better known than the Masahiros, and have a Fit& Finish that's exceptional at this price level.
Steel, balance, profile are very different.
Use the Google search function.
Site:kitchenknifeforums.com Misono AND Masahiro

 

[Jovidah]

Yeah availability is a big reason. Misonos can be bought almost everywhere, even in shops that only dabble in J-knives to a limited extent. The Masahiros on the other hand only have a few retailers in the west. And in the rare case a shop caries Masahiro that's still no guarantee they'll carry the carbon lines.
Also, whether you like that dragon or not, it probably helped Misono get sales and recognition in the west. I think for a long time it was the standard gateway knife.

 

[Danzo]

Left to right starting with partially shown: Sakai ichimonji cleaver, Toyama(taped up), masashi kobo, masahiro, heavily thinned KU Tanaka, and the handle of mazaki (baseball bat)

 

[Danzo]

And forgive me if I wasn’t crystal clear in my last post, I was comparing a 240 masahiro to a 210 misono. That’s was also probably the last 210 I’ll ever buy. At that point I had officially graduated, but had just came up on a used one at a price I couldn’t ignore, and needed a guinea pig for rehandleing