Wide-bevel : looks or performance?

[StephenYu]

Hi guys,

I am interested in trying a wide-bevel gyuto but I don't really know how is it different from normal convex grind. What are the usual characteristics of a wide-bevel knife? Do they cut better or not? Usually tougher and more hefty? Did research but didn't find much information on that beside that the sharpening technique is different (basically thinning and sharpening on the wide bevel at the same time).

Obviously there are less choices (that I know of) in wide bevel gyutos, Syousin Sakura, Kagekiyo, Heiji, Kochi V2 are some who called a real wide bevel knife, while others such as kono fujiyama, tesshu and mizuno doesn't have a significant bevel as those mentioned above...feel free to comment and compare if you have used any of them.

 

[labor of love]

Yeah it's pretty much impossible to generalize wide bevels and their performance. I mean there's stuff like watanabe, kagekiyo and everything in between.

 

[Brady686]

Like labor said, can't generalize them. They're all very different, I own a heiji, kagekiyo, Fujiyama, tesshu and every knife is different from one another. Heiji is very hefty and runs l a little longer than stated, great cutter very toothy edge as well. Kagekiyo b1 is awesome, looks similar to the Fujiyama, but the kagekiyo is a bit thicker at the spine but has a very good taper, amazing cutter, edge retention, grind and tip action. I have a few kono Fujiyama and they are all slightly different as well but, most Fujiyamas are scary thin and cut ridiculously well especially vegetables. My tesshu is a honyaki so it's got a great potential for sharpness and edge retention, amazing grind by an awesome blacksmith.

 

[kevpenbanc]

I have a Tanaka Ginsan and Moritaka AS which are wide bevels.
As already stated, the differences between knives far outweigh any difference in bevels.

A better aporoach may be to state your preferences in a knife and then post a query to see if there is a wide bevel variety that suites your preferences.

 

[kevpenbanc]

As to your query about differences in performance, I can't really tell to be honest.
They both cut really well, much like my other knives with convex grinds.
Easier to sharpen though.

 

[Matus]

With a non-wide bevel knife you get knife with a geometry that (with very few exceptoins) is convex. Wide bevel knives may their wide bevels have slightly convex, flat or concave, what of course changes the properties of the blade a lot.

 

[cyberbaton]

I don't think that wide bevels are easier to sharpen, but it definitely easier to restore decent finish/look after thinning.

 

[ThEoRy]

I feel the purpose of a wide bevel gyuto is so that you can maintain the original geometry of the knife through "thinning" throughout it's lifespan.

 

[Ruso]

As other's have mentioned it goes blade by blade. I have Heiji and I don't like it very much, wedges way to much.
On another hand I love using Kurosaki Syousin Chiku. A great cutter.

 

[cheflivengood]

I feel the purpose of a wide bevel gyuto is so that you can maintain the original geometry of the knife through "thinning" throughout it's lifespan.

As always Theory is correct on this one, it's most of my kit is/was wide bevel.

 

[StephenYu]

thanks for the input guys
I think I should narrow down the comparison, if both knives are made by the same smith, same steel, same HT (I suppose), will wide bevel just affect the look or it will affect the performance as well?
For example:
Yoshikazu Ikeda 210mm Gyuto Shirogami #2 Kiriba Grind
http://bernal-cutlery.shoplightspeed.com/yoshikazu-ikeda-210mm-gyuto-shirogami-2-kiriba-gri.html

Yoshikazu Ikeda 210mm Gyuto Shirogami #2
http://bernal-cutlery.shoplightspeed.com/yoshikazu-ikeda-shirogami-2-210mm-gyuto-iron-clad.html

Both gyutos are made by Yoshikazu Ikeda, shirogami #2 with iron cladding, will they have any difference in performance?

 

[Matus]

I just happen to have a 210 Ikeda W#2 (like on the bottom photo of yours) from BernalCutlery that I am supposed to make a handle for (at some point) I could make some measurements if you like so that you get an idea on geometry, but I have not used the knife and I do not intend to do that as I want to leave the first cut to its owner. What I can say right away is that the knife is not super thin - somewhere middle road. The grind looks excellent and reminds me of how Itinomonn StainLess is ground (that is fantastically performing knife) - the photos on the BC page show that well though. The finish is nice, but it is not a typical hon-kasumi finish - the jigane is very 'matted' (though does not look sandblasted like the it does on the Itinomonn - close to hagane). The spine is rounded, the heel is not.

 

[Ruso]

Both gyutos are made by Yoshikazu Ikeda, shirogami #2 with iron cladding, will they have any difference in performance?

If the wide bevel is a real wide bevel and not just aesthetic change, then there will be definitely a difference in performance.
And here is where the personal preferences come in, sorry. I tend to like wide bevels lately. Also, as Theory have mentioned they are easier to thin....

 

[Choppin]

Curiously I was looking at these two today... actually considering buying the non-wide bevel unhandled one, but mostly because the Ikedas from Bernal come with fairly large handles, as you can see in the photos (just something to keep in mind if you decide on them)

thanks for the input guys
I think I should narrow down the comparison, if both knives are made by the same smith, same steel, same HT (I suppose), will wide bevel just affect the look or it will affect the performance as well?
For example:
Yoshikazu Ikeda 210mm Gyuto Shirogami #2 Kiriba Grind
http://bernal-cutlery.shoplightspeed.com/yoshikazu-ikeda-210mm-gyuto-shirogami-2-kiriba-gri.html

Yoshikazu Ikeda 210mm Gyuto Shirogami #2
http://bernal-cutlery.shoplightspeed.com/yoshikazu-ikeda-shirogami-2-210mm-gyuto-iron-clad.html

Both gyutos are made by Yoshikazu Ikeda, shirogami #2 with iron cladding, will they have any difference in performance?