District Cutlery style TF regrind service for Europe?

[miggus]

I have a few TFs which I adore but all of them have a bit excess fat on the ribs. I had dabbled with the idea of doing it myself, but I realize that it won't be as clean and well-done as I would like this to be. Thing is, I'm in Europe. Sending the knives to the US would double the cost and be also somewhat wasteful.

But with all the good knifemakers on the old continent, there has to be someone who will do a similar thing, right? If you know someone her who can and will do this, please let me know.

 

[jedy617]

Sell yours, and buy direct from District and have them do it? Or I guess find a reputable knife maker who would be willing to do a regrind? For me, shipping to Germany is around $40-$50 for a package that could fit about 3-4 knives. Not sure that is exactly double the cost, even if it's more expensive or there

 

[miggus]

Sell the TFs? Hah! Never.. But yeah, sending more of them in a package actually shouldn't cost the world, that is true. It's not urgently necessary at the moment, even though they would benefit already... but they will need quite a bit of thinning in a while.

 

[WildBoar]

Know anyone taking to trip to the DC area anytime soon? You can ask them to transport in the checked bags. One of us DC-area members can get the to the shop for 'treatment'.

 

[kpham12]

I believe there are a number of German makers who could do the work.
https://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/threads/kaeru-wakui-workhorse-210mm-eu.61757/This was an example of a knife thinned by Suntravel who I believe shaved 14 grams off the knife, a TF would likely need much less metal removal. Maybe message the seller from the thread if they have his info or know of any other makers. I think there’s a German KKF equivalent forum as well, maybe post there?

 

[Heckel7302]

My vote would be to try it yourself, then you could always bail out if it’s not going well and send it to Ryan.

 

[riba]

Try schanz-shop.de - Alles für den Messermacher, Messermacherbedarf, handgemachte Messer, Schmuck und Damaststahl.

He thinned my hiromoto honyaki

https://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/threads/knife-tuning-in-the-netherlands.47263/#post-711851

 

[BarryMM]

Ask Milan Gravier

 

[miggus]

Thanks everyone for the great suggestions. I think everyone in Europe looking for such a regrind should find a solution in here now

I will post here once I have reached out to someone about thinning.

 

[Sdo]

Doesn't Cleancut do this?

 

[miggus]

I'll askt them @Sdo

 

[Sdo]

I'll askt them @Sdo

Let us know

 

[gc0220]

I have a few TFs which I adore but all of them have a bit excess fat on the ribs. I had dabbled with the idea of doing it myself, but I realize that it won't be as clean and well-done as I would like this to be. Thing is, I'm in Europe. Sending the knives to the US would double the cost and be also somewhat wasteful.

But with all the good knifemakers on the old continent, there has to be someone who will do a similar thing, right? If you know someone her who can and will do this, please let me know.

Sending them to the US would be silly man. There are tons of people in Europe who could do that for you. I can't help you in finding one but I just wanted to say that. Also on a knife like that it's not as hard as you might think. This is for sure one of the easier knives to tinker with like that. Try it yourself on maybe a smaller knife, a petty if you have one. If you don't like, you can still pay someone else to do it. You don't have to do it on stones or entirely on stones either. Sandpaper works just fine..

 

[miggus]

Thanks @gc0220.
I agree that there should be someone to do it over here. The perk with District Cutlery would be that one knows exactly what to get in their TF reworks. I have attempted something similar with a Moritaka Gyuto. It wasn't soo difficult to do it from a functional perspective, but I'd like to have a crisp shinogi line and something that's well-done by capable craftspeople. And I'm not that

I have a bit too many stones from 120 to 8000, so the material is here. But I also don't really want to put in 8 hours or so to do it all on stainless and end up with a mediocre result... the Denkas are the wrong knives to practice on. They're meticulously crafted, aesthetically perfect in every detail, and I want to keep it that way. OK the last sentence was just for fun, but I really would like a result like some of the capable people here are showing. That I can't do at the moment.

 

[riba]

Sending them to the US would be silly man. There are tons of people in Europe who could do that for you. I can't help you in finding one but I just wanted to say that....

While I agree with the sentiment, it would be also nice to know who would be able and willing

 

[milangravier]

I am a knifemaker first I think. I like to create the object from A to Z.
But for 3 years I have pushed the Stone polishing and sharpening part of my work and it is now one of the biggest part of my process.
I have worked on some blades that were not mine in the past and be happy (not meaning happy enough to not being paid) to work on other blades sometimes, so why not you TF.
I think Sheffield Knife Sharpening on instagram should propose that type of services too.

 

[miggus]

Let us know

So, I asked Cleancut if they do this, to which I received a detailed answer. I also asked permission to post their answer on this thread, to which they agreed, so here it is:

This is a indeed a difficult topic. While we regularly do refinishing and thinning, it is not a service that can be applied genericly to a knife. Clad material and grind play a major role here, and the work can easily vary between 2-4 hours. On top of that you have customer expectations that greatly differ.

We dont use a belt grinder or a large vertical ceramic wheel that would produce the same result every time. We use regular whetstones. For this reason I must decline your request.

Takeda, Moritaka, Shiro Kamo etc are knives that we regularly thin and give a nice kasumi finish. They are not easy either, nothing is, but the iron clad and even grinds make it possible to refinish a knife in a reasonable time frame. We usually accept these jobs in-store where we can examine the grind for high and low spots to better avaluate the work and set reasonable expectations for our customer.

Its perfectly fine to post this answer

I have worked on some blades that were not mine in the past and be happy (not meaning happy enough to not being paid) to work on other blades sometimes, so why not you TF.

Thanks Milan, that sounds great! I'll send you a PM.

I think Sheffield Knife Sharpening on instagram should propose that type of services too.

What they offer looks very promising, I'm sure they could handle the TF reworking. I'm a bit unsure though about complications between EU and UK at this point, so EU-based vendors will be preferred.

 

[adrianopedro]

You can send the knives to Rodrigo @togidai.uk

He is a pro sharpener, member of Hitohira World Sharpeners Union


https://www.instagram.com/togidai.uk/

 

[Sdo]

So, I asked Cleancut if they do this, to which I received a detailed answer. I also asked permission to post their answer on this thread, to which they agreed, so here it is:




Thanks Milan, that sounds great! I'll send you a PM.


What they offer looks very promising, I'm sure they could handle the TF reworking. I'm a bit unsure though about complications between EU and UK at this point, so EU-based vendors will be preferred.

It is a pity that Cleancut are unable to do it but it is understandable.

To send it to the UK or the US is exactly the same thing. You would have to pay taxes including VAT.

Many thanks for sharing!

Cheers.

 

[Sdo]

You can send the knives to Rodrigo @togidai.uk

He is a pro sharpener, member of Hitohira World Sharpeners Union


https://www.instagram.com/togidai.uk/

He seems to be based in the UK. The above would apply.

 

[miggus]

To send it to the UK or the US is exactly the same thing. You would have to pay taxes including VAT.

Yes and no. To be precise, it is possible to label goods as repair shipping and not pay tax or only pay tax for the amount of money the repair costs, i.e. the actual added value: post vat information. I assume something similar is possible if sending to the US.

The thing is, this can be denied and there is some level of documentation required etc... way too much potential for headaches / extra costs if there are alternatives inside the EU. But if you definitely need this, there is a way.

(Side note: I'm confident that now, where the tone between the two blocks is getting constructive again, it is only a matter of time until EU and UK come to some sort of customs agreement to make everyone's life easier. But how long this will take is everybody's guess).

 

[Sdo]

Yes and no. To be precise, it is possible to label goods as repair shipping and not pay tax or only pay tax for the amount of money the repair costs, i.e. the actual added value: post vat information. I assume something similar is possible if sending to the US.

The thing is, this can be denied and there is some level of documentation required etc... way too much potential for headaches / extra costs if there are alternatives inside the EU. But if you definitely need this, there is a way.

(Side note: I'm confident that now, where the tone between the two blocks is getting constructive again, it is only a matter of time until EU and UK come to some sort of customs agreement to make everyone's life easier. But how long this will take is everybody's guess).

Just read the documentation needed for this and I agree with you. The risk that something goes wrong is pretty relevant. Seems a real pain in the arse.

Nice to know that there might be a way to escape VAT though. Thanks again for sharing.

Hope you are right about EU and UK customs agreement.

Cheers.

 

[Infrared]

https://sharpedgeshop.com/pages/knife-sharpening-repairs-service

 

[milangravier]

I am not sure I understand the answer of CleanCut here.
They decline because they work with bench stones ?
Belt grinder or horizontal wheel won't give the same result every time but being power tools you can work with them making a straight shinogi (looking good) but with a poor geometry underneath the scratches. They hide mistakes and poor geometry, maybe that what they mean by "same result".

And actually whetstones wont make it better : it is not because you work with whetstones that you're doing a great job and you can mess the geometry of a knife just as easily than working with a powertool... You normally won't affect the heat treat, that still a good point.
I did not answer to your mail yet. But yes, a proper examination of the knives will be necessary before saying how long I will spend on them. I can just put a ruler on the bevels and that will give me some info about how much I will have to grind, and how long that's gonna take. And maybe after you sent me the knife and I will tell you the time I will spend you finally prefer to do it yourself... To be honest, a 240mm knife will take between 4 to 8 hours at least to be worked on whetstones to a good geometry with a fine polishing, meaning you can put a jnat under your bevel and the stone will touch the bevel everywhere. So 4 to 8 hours will need to be paid. Working a knife and putting a good geometry on it with whetstones so you have a clean convex surface with no uneveness is a long work.
The only way to speed up the process is to accept low spots, concave surfaces on the bevel, working to get a clean and thin part like 3mm around the edge and then just use finger stones to hide all the mess.
Another thing I can understand from Cleancut : true not every knife will be easy to work and give a good bevel again. And maybe TF will ask to grind or too much the edge or too much the kurushi to get rid of all the problems. True is that if you just want to thin the knife without getting a clean geometry, I am not sure I can do the job.

 

[Benuser]

I understand the Cleancut answer in a slightly different way. They are not used to these knives, do not sell them, they can't see them in real life in their shop, can't discuss what are realistic expectations and what aren't. They can't tell you whether it takes 4 or 8 hours and how the final result will be. It makes it hazardous to agree on a budget for a given outcome.

 

[milangravier]

I understand the Cleancut answer in a slightly different way. They are not used to these knives, do not sell them, they can't see them in real life in their shop, can't discuss what are realistic expectations and what aren't. They can't tell you whether it takes 4 or 8 hours and how the final result will be. It makes it hazardous to agree on a budget for a given outcome.

I guess it is like for most little complex work : You estimate with your experience... they say they regularly thin and repolish knives with whetstones. They could start the deal with their worst experience and say it will take more than 8 hours ? I mean, they could say it is difficult to say but without having the knife in hand it can take maybe 8 hours so that will cost... something. Then client choose. I don't understand why they would decline the request, just because work on whetstone is long and somehow a bit hasardous (which is questionnable)

 

[Benuser]

I guess it is like for most little complex work : You estimate with your experience... they say they regularly thin and repolish knives with whetstones. They could start the deal with their worst experience and say it will take more than 8 hours ? I mean, they could say it is difficult to say but without having the knife in hand it can take maybe 8 hours so that will cost... something. Then client choose. I don't understand why they would decline the request, just because work on whetstone is long and somehow a bit hasardous (which is questionnable)

The outcome is too uncertain. Remember Mr Martell who refused repairing Moritakas who came to often with terrible overgrinds.

 

[daddy yo yo]

The outcome is too uncertain. Remember Mr Martell who refused repairing Moritakas who came to often with terrible overgrinds.

I remember. BTW, I truly hope that Dave comes on his feet again!

 

[milangravier]

The outcome is too uncertain. Remember Mr Martell who refused repairing Moritakas who came to often with terrible overgrinds.

Yes I understand. My logic is as soon as I am paid for some work, the outcome is there. But true most customer may refuse a 12 hours sharpening on their knives that would cost maybe half or full price of a knife.

 

[Benuser]

Yes I understand. My logic is as soon as I am paid for some work, the outcome is there. But true most customer may refuse a 12 hours sharpening on their knives that would cost maybe half or full price of a knife.

Even worse: asking the owner to pay two hours of work (€150) and tell him, the overgrind can't be fixed.