The Washita Thread

Kitchen Knife Forums

Help Support Kitchen Knife Forums:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.
Here's a follow-up post to my one above, and I'm afraid it will be based even more on conjecture and hunch than the previous.

A question that's the basis of some of the conversation on this thread and elsewhere, is this:




To what extent can we consider Washitas and Soft Arkansas stones as being the same thing? Can any strict differentiation actually be made?

The whetstone quarries of Hot Springs are all found in together in quite a small geographical area, and they’re all pulling the same type of rock - novaculite - out of the ground. But geological formations don’t happen in neat, well-defined boxes, so that millions of years later someone can put a label on a sharpening stone and sell it as one thing or the other. They happen on a spectrum.

---

Let's start by looking at a couple of interesting stones owned by members on B&B. These are both labelled Pike Soft Arkansas, the first is notably quite translucent with a SG of 2.55, the second I don't know but I'd guess a little less:

View attachment 163740

View attachment 163739



Now a labelled Pike Lily White of mine, also fairly translucent, though the SG is lower at 2.36. This is admittedly quite an unusual Washita, but visually these three stones are peas in a pod, the pores and patterns on the surface are strikingly similar:

View attachment 163764

---

So why are Pike selling stones that I would bet my bottom dollar are the same, as two different things?

The charitable answer might be that they too recognise the blurred lines of definition in geological formations, but use their years of expertise and experience to evaluate hardness, porosity and specific gravity, in order to determine what stones are Washitas, and what are Soft Arkansas.

The less charitable answer though might recognise that Pike were undeniably superb at reading and dictating the market for their products. And that in the late 19th Century had bought a number (all?) of the old Washita quarries, as well as George Reynolds - probably the only other company who were producing them. And so frankly Pike could sell whatever they want, as whatever they want, depending on what they thought might make the most money.

Here’s a very interesting 19th century advertisement for Pike oilstones:

View attachment 163737

I’ve posted that page before here, but until now I hadn’t noticed that Soft Arkansas stones are conspicuous in their absence. Though by 1905 a Pike pamphlet does mention them, and notes they 'generally sell at about one-third less price than Hard Arkansas‘. Which still makes them just a little bit more expensive than even Lily White or Rosy Red Washitas. Could it be that the entire idea of a ‘Soft Arkansas’ whetstone was simply an invention of Pike’s, after acquiring the Sutton quarries, in order to ride on the coat tails of the high prices and demand for ‘Hard Arkansas’ stones?*

At the end of my post above is a lineup pic of the old Washitas I have atm, which were all found in either the UK or Aus:

View attachment 163760

I have no doubt that all of these stones were originally sold as 'Washitas'; the name had considerable cachet and market recognition in the UK, and it is still far more common to find old Washitas in the UK than it is in the US. But might the same stones have been sold as something else back in the states?

I don't know the answer to these questions. This is all speculation.

---

I received an exciting delivery today, this is the first labelled Soft Arkansas stone I have ever had or used:

View attachment 163763

Can you guess why I bought it? Pretty huh! The 'holder' there actually turned out to be the top of the box, and it told me that this is soft ark produced by:

View attachment 163746

Global recognition no less! Colour me tantalised...**

So obviously I'm going to compare it some Washitas. Just to emphasise - this isn't a new stone that has been sold as a Washita - it's positioning itself firmly in the Soft Ark camp. It's also a sample size of one, so we're not in particularly scientific territory here. Nevertheless I'm interested to see how deep the familial resemblance runs, especially as I said, because this is the first time I've used a Soft Ark. These stones are arranged in descending order of specific gravity, and when I measured them today the LW and No.1 actually surprised me a little, as in my mind they were both a bit higher, but there you go.

L to R: Pike Lily White (2.36), Washita (2.30), Pike-Norton No.1 (2.10), Natural Hones Soft Ark (2.09), Washita (2.08):

View attachment 163762

Obviously here I've chosen Washitas 3 and 5 because they have almost identical SG readings to the Soft Ark, so if the distinction is as blurry as some of what I've said above might suggest, then we should be able to see a fairly strong similarity between them. Washitas 1 and 2 I've chosen because their SG is at the higher end of the scale - to see if the soft ark is more similar to the low SG Washitas, than they are to the higher ones.

---

Well first up - the Soft Ark is noticeably softer than a Washita, it takes no time at all to lap. When done the surface feels similar-ish, though slightly grittier, sandier. I'm actually a little surprised it's as different as it is.

Washita 1 (Pike LW) is a very fine example, it works quite fast for a fine stone, but it doesn’t have a big range. It doesn’t do super-quick and coarse metal removal like more typical examples.

Washita 2 (which I found at the weekend here is Aus) is a superb stone. With noticeably larger, more visible pores than the first. This stone has a big range and is seriously fast with pressure. Right up there with my favourite Washitas I've had.

Washita 3 (P-N No.1) is a very good stone also, it has quite a large range though not as fast as the above. Finishes surprisingly fine considering the SG.

The NHI Soft Ark (4) is quite clearly a different stone from the Washitas. It feels as much like a Hindostan as it does a Washita. It's a very fast stone, and slurries quite heavily in almost no time, but doesn't finish nearly as fine as the Washitas. Overall it’s not a million miles away in terms of use, but there’s no way you’d confuse them. In a funny way this stone feels most similar to Washita 2, which I think is a very old stone.

Washita 5 is very similar to 3, though it’s a little coarser. 3 and 5 I would consider as quite typical Norton era Washitas. Very nice stone.

---

I don't know if or what any of that might say. Except that there are some Soft Arks that are notably different from old Washitas. This stone is considerably softer than the Washitas with an identical SG, and a lot of its speed is coming from slurry. But it's similar enough to bear comparison.

There is certainly something special about old Washitas, but it’s by no means inconceivable that other quarries and companies apart from P-N have at some point dug up the same kind stone. So I can't really conclude anything more revolutionary than saying that I think a Washita is a hard version of a soft ark. Or a porous version of a hard ark. And how and where those distinctions are drawn probably just depends on who's cutting it up, and putting it in neat boxes.

---

* I could probably get a better idea of whether this possibility has any legs or not by reading through Griswold again. I may do that later...

** Anyone heard of this company? Considering the breadth of their alleged market penetration they have curiously little interenet presence...
It's interesting to note that old Washita's are showing up in boxes labeled Soft Ark but I have never seen it the other way around. Maybe it's just owners switching boxes, I don't know. There is a difference in price when the soft arks first show up also. The price difference probably corresponds to the difficulty in mining the arks compared to the Washita that came out in big blocks.

From the looks of your colored soft it is indistinguishable from a modern Washita, and your description is exactly what I get from them. Kind of a gritty feel, friable and fast but they lack the range of vintage Washita's.
 
I like the patches for my back. I can't really walk without the ointment for my feet and ankles though. Fusion surgery coming up in March. I hope it helps.
Ooph! Back pain sucks. Hope it all goes well for and you have a fast recovery. My brother in law had it done a couple of years ago, he said it was instant relief.
 
Ooph! Back pain sucks. Hope it all goes well for and you have a fast recovery. My brother in law had it done a couple of years ago, he said it was instant relief.

Fusion for the foot and ankle. The back stuff isn't really serious. But thank you for the well wishes. You all will probably be sick of me after my two months of bed rest. Nothing to do but rest and heal and bid on vintage oil stones.
 
I just had these arrive on my doorstep.
Not washita's but what they are I don't know, .
IMG20220204155848.jpg
IMG20220204155900.jpg
IMG20220204155938.jpg
IMG20220204164115.jpg
IMG20220204164144.jpg
IMG20220204164212.jpg
IMG20220204164332.jpg
IMG20220204164405.jpg

The small stone makes a nice grey slurry. It has a greeny grey hue.

The "Celebrate" brand is man made,very hard but cuts ok. Put an ok bevel on white 1.

The medium stone is different colors on both sides with one side coloured dark and light grey with darker grey swirls and specks. This side felt nice on a knife, gave a nice edge.
The other side is a fairly even dark grey. This felt harder than the coloured side, harder to raise a burr.

The large block is black and hard. It's huge though, 1.5kg. Maybe a Turkish?
 
I just had these arrive on my doorstep.
Not washita's but what they are I don't know, .View attachment 164085View attachment 164090View attachment 164091View attachment 164092View attachment 164093View attachment 164094View attachment 164095View attachment 164096
The small stone makes a nice grey slurry. It has a greeny grey hue.

The "Celebrate" brand is man made,very hard but cuts ok. Put an ok bevel on white 1.

The medium stone is different colors on both sides with one side coloured dark and light grey with darker grey swirls and specks. This side felt nice on a knife, gave a nice edge.
The other side is a fairly even dark grey. This felt harder than the coloured side, harder to raise a burr.

The large block is black and hard. It's huge though, 1.5kg. Maybe a Turkish?
Austin sure is interesting. How would you describe how it cuts, very fine to very coarse?
 
I just had these arrive on my doorstep.
Not washita's but what they are I don't know, .View attachment 164085View attachment 164090View attachment 164091View attachment 164092View attachment 164093View attachment 164094View attachment 164095View attachment 164096
The small stone makes a nice grey slurry. It has a greeny grey hue.

The "Celebrate" brand is man made,very hard but cuts ok. Put an ok bevel on white 1.

The medium stone is different colors on both sides with one side coloured dark and light grey with darker grey swirls and specks. This side felt nice on a knife, gave a nice edge.
The other side is a fairly even dark grey. This felt harder than the coloured side, harder to raise a burr.

The large block is black and hard. It's huge though, 1.5kg. Maybe a Turkish?

Very cool!

The larger one isn’t a Turkish I’m afraid - it’s some kind of slate or schist.

The long, medium one looks very interesting. Some parts of it again look like slate, but those surface patterns don’t at all. Unless it’s a very weird old Coticule, I’ve not come across anything like it.

Definitely post some more pics if you lap or clean it up more!
 
Cuts very fine, not as fine as my charnley, on the swirls. On the dark grey side it's definitely harder and cuts less.

I've only had a quick slide with the steel on stone as the family has got home.
I think it's a Thuringian and a very attractive one.
 
bfsu,
Here is link to another form thread with some Thuringians that are described as clouded. There are more scattered through out the thread.
I'm not %100 percent on my ID but I would literally put money on it.
https://www.badgerandblade.com/foru...ingian-love-show-of-your-rocks.320736/page-44

That is interesting! I think you're onto something DR. This picture nabbed from that thread looks very similar to the side of your stone @bsfsu :

1.jpg


That's a very sweet find if it is a Thuri :).
 
I sharpened some knives with that monster butterscotch washita. It is my new favorite knife stone. Beating out my unlabelled probably lily white washita. Super hard but super porous. Fast on the attack but leaves a fine crispy edge. I've tried it with water and oil and I definitely prefer the oil.

I was literally just about to post these pictures and say - if anybody comes across stones that look like this (and your one) that they should be snapped up.

I've used these two a fair bit now in the last few days, and they're the best two Washitas I've had. Behave exactly as you describe yours. They've also both had several days of soaking, and that oil ain't going anywhere particularly quickly!

IMG-5082.jpg


IMG-5083.jpg
 
I sharpened some knives with that monster butterscotch washita. It is my new favorite knife stone. Beating out my unlabelled probably lily white washita. Super hard but super porous. Fast on the attack but leaves a fine crispy edge. I've tried it with water and oil and I definitely prefer the oil.

The other very cool thing about your stone is that it looks from some of the pictures like one side is harder and more translucent than the other? Like a natural combi. Is there a difference is use? Cos that would be awesome!
 
The other very cool thing about your stone is that it looks from some of the pictures like one side is harder and more translucent than the other? Like a natural combi. Is there a difference is use? Cos that would be awesome!

I haven't tried the side with the big chip in it yet. But it feels to the fingers much more homogenous than it looks.

PXL_20220205_021757670.jpg

PXL_20220205_021754344.MP.jpg


Next to the lily white
PXL_20220205_021825130.jpg

PXL_20220205_021926842.jpg
 
I haven't tried the side with the big chip in it yet. But it feels to the fingers much more homogenous than it looks.

View attachment 164255
View attachment 164256

Next to the lily white
View attachment 164257
View attachment 164258

Cool! Yeah it does look like the two sides might be slightly different, I'd guess the chipped side might be harder and finer. There's a bit in the Griswold 1890 survey about the layers of Washita stone, and how they're cut.

This I guess is probably what has resulted in my little one that's much more translucent in the middle - it's been cut across layers, giving 'areas of unequal hardness'. But yours looks like it's been cut well - parallel to the layers. And might give you basically a natural combi, which would be pretty awesome! Definitely try it out and report back...


Screenshot 2022-02-04 011715.jpg


(And yeah I'd be with you - I think your other stone is very likely to be a Norton era Lily White.)
 
That is interesting! I think you're onto something DR. This picture nabbed from that thread looks very similar to the side of your stone @bsfsu :

View attachment 164240

That's a very sweet find if it is a Thuri :).
Ya, there are probably hundreds of Thuri's in that thread posted by some very serious collectors and Austin is probably probably the most unusual.
Quite a find indeed.

Bsfsu, that small stone doesn't really look like a thuri ,but I'm not ready to discount it being a rubber stone to your Thuri. It also looks wider than the Thuri?
 
Thuringian Hones are really nice, for razors. They are much to fine for any kitchen cutlery. They outclass even the finest Nakayama`s.

I think the big one is a levante/turkey/cretan hone. And the Thuri is a Thuri.

SirCutALot.
 
Ya, there are probably hundreds of Thuri's in that thread posted by some very serious collectors and Austin is probably probably the most unusual.
Quite a find indeed.

Bsfsu, that small stone doesn't really look like a thuri ,but I'm not ready to discount it being a rubber stone to your Thuri. It also looks wider than the Thuri?
@Desert Rat I have been wondering about the small slurry stone. It is wider than the thuri and completely a different colour.

@SirCutAlot I have got a nice edge on a W2 knife with the thuri but definitely quite hard. I want to have a play with some chisels and plane blades at some stage.
IMG20220206094421.jpg
IMG20220206094429.jpg
IMG20220206094440.jpg


The large black slate looks to have been cut down at different times as there is 3 types of cut marks on it, I'm thinking it's been around for a while. It seems harder than the thuri but I need to have some more play time with it. I need some scissor finishing stones so these are all going into the collection.
IMG20220205173701.jpg
IMG20220205173721.jpg
IMG20220205173734.jpg
IMG20220206094531.jpg

I'm hoping to get some washita's soon! (might be SiC though)
 
had a great day with two pieces of Novaculite. huge cooking day with the boys, lots of fun both of them contributed really strongly to three fairly labor-intensive recipes. We’re making some friends a big Thai breakfast tomorrow for one of their birthdays. So we had to make pork stock, Thai pork meatballs, and what is essentially Thai flavored pork barbecue. Had to dress a huge piece of pork shoulder and my grandfathers Washita came to the rescue. Just look at how much steel it removed with a few swipes. Put a great Butchery edge on a semi stainless chicken knife. Later I decided to finally put a good edge on the MagnaCut knife. That stuff is a ***** to sharpen. And especially deburr properly. Once again the Soft Arkansas Stone was the star of the day to get rid of the last nasty butr left behind from the diamond stones. Great day in the kitchen, great day with some novaculite.
Plus some cats since you know, that's what the internet is for.
831D672F-A576-4FB1-8D71-26C0F6F74FD9.jpeg
57B18B5D-B44F-4600-9CDF-2B796226AA0B.jpeg
72C1BC19-AAAE-4687-91D9-D782645189D5.jpeg
 
Last edited:
From the looks of your colored soft it is indistinguishable from a modern Washita.

Though I’ve never tried a newer coloured Washita I imagine you’re probably right, and that my Soft Ark is a similar affair.

I went through Griswold again, while thinking about this a bit more and it threw up some very interesting things, which I’ll collate in another post. But here’s a bit to start (I’m sure you’ve seen this already, but worth highlighting again)...

It’s very obvious that the stones we’re calling ‘modern’ Washitas were also considered Washitas back in 1890, Griswold describes them in some detail. Generally they were considered somewhat inferior, second class stones. But they were still Washitas. Here’s his description of ‘Calico Washitas’, quite clearly what my Soft Ark is:


E82F5655-E443-40EB-969D-17B1C308FE25.jpeg


I also picked up a little stone yesterday for my collection of cardboard box Nortons, as I didn’t have a soft previously. This stone is very different from the Calico soft. The Norton isn’t even close to being a Washita - it bears more comparison to a hard ark, while the Calico stone does have some similarities to old Washitas.

F6D8AFED-1BF6-49B3-BFFE-870D683E1E1B.jpeg
 
Last edited:
Speaking of Thuris... a couple of other nice new stones I found recently. This little Bengall was a very cheap FB marketplace find and came with a 6x1.25 Escher :)

CC197433-C5D3-4038-A0F8-0A07C7230199.jpeg

D4687DAF-6E97-4778-909D-FEE615D9D0D5.jpeg

98EF1B34-6DF7-4F9E-8731-2ABB0A6FFB63.jpeg


And then a slightly weird paddle stone from ebay turned out to be Schwedenstein:

9F912E47-8A27-48CA-AF18-421188348BFD.jpeg


Which piqued my interest and so I swapped another stone for a larger example with someone on B&B. This stone is one of Peter / Hatzicho’s:

56439B25-0E4D-4A0D-81C4-6CD5A003CD28.jpeg

9547C5B5-9F81-43F7-B62A-689971B00AC0.jpeg
 
So for anyone still with me, a final follow-up post or two on the subject of if, and how, it is possible to make any firm distinction between Washita stones and Soft Arkansas.

Reading through Griswold again with particular reference to this question threw up a few interesting things: Firstly there appears to be no mention of 'Soft Arkansas' - in 1890 it was simply not a category of whetstone. The two types of stone were 'Arkansas' stones, which we would know as Translucent and probably Hard Black, and 'Ouachita' stones which seem to have encompassed everything else. There are detailed descriptions of the kinds of coloured, patterned, or mottled, stones that are sometimes sold today as Washitas. The 'Calico' Ouachita described below is very obviously what my brightly coloured Soft Arkansas is:

E82F5655-E443-40EB-969D-17B1C308FE25.jpeg


These are said to be of generally inferior quality to the pure white variety, but they were Ouachita stones nonetheless.

To say then that the modern Washita stones are merely 'a kind of soft ark', and that only Pike and Norton stones are true Washitas, is not quite accurate. The name Washita was originally applied in the early 1800s to stones transported down the Ouachita river to market, and I think it's fair to say for a good proportion of the 19th century was applied to both the stones we call 'Washitas' and 'Soft Arkansas'.

History as we all know, is written by the winners. And in this case the winners, having bought out all the competition, and bought up all the quarries, were Pike. I feel fairly confident that the earlier hypothesis that 'Soft Arkansas' stones were merely an invention of the Pike Manufacturing Co., is accurate. So let's again ask: Why?

In an earlier post I imagined two possible reasons:

'The charitable answer might be that they too recognise the blurred lines of definition in geological formations, but use their years of expertise and experience to evaluate hardness, porosity and specific gravity, in order to determine what stones are Washitas, and what are Soft Arkansas.

The less charitable answer though might recognise that Pike were undeniably superb at reading and dictating the market for their products. And that in the late 19th Century had bought a number (all?) of the old Washita quarries, as well as George Reynolds - probably the only other company who were producing them. And so frankly Pike could sell whatever they want, as whatever they want, depending on what they thought might make the most money.'


Though perhaps the actual answer is likely to be a combination of both.

I also tried to explain the importance of porosity on the workings of the Washita stone, and this is something looked at in considerable detail in the Griswold survey. At one point he even goes so far as to say that the porosity of the Ouachita stone means that it cannot be classed amongst the 'true novaculites'. While acknowledging that it is exactly this porosity that makes its cutting so remarkable, and that the best stones are the most porous examples.

The table below is particularly interesting. In it the first two rows are (hard) 'Arkansas' stones, the third is a control stone, and all the others are 'Ouachitas'. You want to be looking at the final column on the right, which is effectively a % measure of porosity:

Screenshot 2022-02-08 124739.png


Griswold tells us at one point later that Sutton No.6 (as well as No.1) was regarded by quarrymen as produced the highest quality of Washita stone, and pictures in Pike pamphlets in the early c.20th show Sutton #7 described as a Washita quarry. We can also assume from this table that Sutton No.5 was producing high quality Washita stone. In fact in that table we might even be able to draw a divinding line between Sutton No.s 5, 6, & 7 which run from about 14-19% water absorption, and the others ranging from 3-6%.

Could this be the kind of distinction made by Pike when determining their definitions of 'Washita' and 'Soft Arkanas' stones? Another question we will probably never know a certain answer to, though it seems a very plausible possibility to me.

---

I'm afraid I'm not going to dedicate the next six months to fully degreasing all of my Washitas in order to measure their % porosity in this way. So the impressions I'm going to give below are a little more subjective, though we'll have some microscope fun too at the end. From here I will be using the terms 'Washita' and 'Soft Arkansas' in the way we would now normally understand them.

At the weekend I found a little 30s/40s era Norton Soft Arkansas slip stone. From a distance the surface of this stone could be mistaken for a Washita stone, especially now that I've used it a little bit. Here it is next to a Norton No.1 Washita of the same era, the stones are both pure white, discolouring grey with oil and swarf:

IMG-5146.jpg


Even up close these two are pretty damn similar, perhaps the Washita is slightly looser grained, less homogenous. But they are, without a doubt, of an ilk:

IMG-5147.jpg


But in the hand they do feel different. The Soft Arkansas has a ceramic quality to it, like china or porcelain. And it feels noticeably smoother than almost all of my Washitas, like it'll be a higher grit stone. Far smoother than my 'Calico' Soft Arkansas, and it is not as fast as either in use. Though again it is not an entirely dissimilar stone - if this was labelled as a Norton Washita I wouldn't question it, it perhaps just wouldn't be my favourite.

So can we see any distinct differences at a microscopic level? The stones I've selected here are to hopefully give a reasonable selection of some different types of Washita, alongside the Norton Soft Arkansas, the Calico Soft Arkansas, and a Norton Hard Arkansas - again from the 30s/40s. I'm going to run out of pictures allowed on this post, so will continue in another below, but here are the stones we'll be looking at.

L to R: Norton Hard Translucent, Norton Soft Arkansas, NHI Calico Soft Arkansas, NOS Norton Lily White, Norton No.1, Unlabelled Washita, Unlabelled Older Washita, Pike Lily White.

IMG-5149.jpg


TBC...
 
Last edited:
So under the microscope we're going to be looking at a couple of different things; Firstly how the Soft Arkansas Stones compare to the Washitas, but also how the two older Washitas at the end compare to the Norton era Washitas.

Norton completed their purchase of Pike Manufacturing Co. in 1933, and immediately slashed the number of 'quality grades' of Washita available. At various times under Pike there had been; Lily White, Rosy Red, Woodworkers' Delight, Mechanics Friend, Extra Quality, No.1, No.2, and possibly others I don't know about. After the Norton takeover these were reduced to simply; Lily White and No.1. And later, in the 60s I believe, just to a single 'Washita Oilstone'.

Was this rationalisation merely an effort to reduce confusion in the minds of the buying public? Or perhaps did they consider some of the old Pike quarries to not be economically viable, which would signify a true reduction in the range? Who knows!

---

Here's what an old Norton Hard Arkansas looks like. This is very typical of translucent Arkansas stones, it is incredibly uniform and fine:

NortonTrans.jpg


Now the Norton Soft Arkansas, far less homogenous and generally slightly coarser grained, though still this is a very tightly packed stone:

NotonSoftArk.jpg


Here's the Calico Soft Arkansas. I took this picture of one of the white parts of it, as the coloured bits were all over the place, and you couldn't really see what was going on. This is much more coarsely grained, and less densely packed, which is what I'd expect:

Calico.jpg


Now the NOS Norton Lily White. This stone is a little hard to take a picture of because I've only used it on one side for a couple of mins, so it's still got a load of lime on it, but here goes:

NortonLW.jpg


WOAH... that looks quite a lot like our Norton Soft Arkansas doesn't it?! Those stones are very similar, though the LW is a perhaps a little less tightly packed, but slightly more homogenous.

Continuing the theme - here's the Norton No.1. This stone has more oil in it, so is a slightly different colour, but this is even more similar to the Soft Ark, which were the two stones I pictured together in the post above:

NortonNo.1.jpg


And this is the unlabelled shorter Washita. In some ways this stone is a bit of an outlier. It's probably the least tightly packed and coarsest grained of the Washitas. Which again makes sense - this stone has the lowest specific gravity of any here:

Washita.jpg


Now a very interesting one - the unlabelled older Washita. This isn't wildly dissimilar from others, and toward the less compact end. What you can't tell from microscope images such as these is how hard a stone is; this is actually quite a hard stone, while looking less compact. This stone probably has a very high level of porosity.

It also, as you can see, has a load of bright pink* bits in it. These are all over the stone, though you can't see them at all with the naked eye. I have no idea what this is, initially I thought I must have spilled something weird on it, but looking back at the other stones afterwards it does appear, in far less quantity (just a handful of specks per stone) on all of them. Possibly this is a microscope image of whatever it was that gave Rosy Reds their name:

InkedOldWashita_LI.jpg


And lastly the Pike Lily White. As I'd expect this is quite densely packed and fine-grained. Again this stone has more of the pink bits than most of the others, though nothing like as much as the previous. Apart from the relatively high amount of pink these two old stones are not desperately alike.

InkedPikeLW_LI.jpg


---

So that basically concludes my thoughts about Washitas v Soft Arks for the time being.

I've just been back and used a few of them again. The Norton Soft Ark finishes as fine as a Washita, but has nothing like the speed. It's effectively like using a heavily clogged Washita stone. The NHI Calico stone is the other end of the spectrum - it'll work as fast as a Washita, but doesn't come close to the top end. In fact the two 'Soft Arkansas' are more dissimilar from each other than they are from the Washitas.

Though every one is the same kind of thing; you could call them all Washitas, or Soft Arkansas, and not be wrong. There's certainly something special about good Washitas, and even though I do really like the Calico stone, every one of my ‘Washitas’ is probably a better stone than the two 'Soft Arkansas'. But I don't see any reason that other companies** apart from Pike-Norton, either now or in the past, couldn't have been pulling up some rocks of equal quality.

(That’s what I think anyway. And it’s not particularly revolutionary I know!)

---

* The reason I've drawn little circles around some of them is because I know at least one person who follows this thread is quite colour-blind, and may not be able to see them. So yeah - those splodges in the circles are neon pink.

** If anybody reading this is lucky enough to have a Dan's Washita that they fancy selling or swapping, then give me a shout. Surely a rarer stone than 'real' Washitas...
 
Last edited:
This thing is pretty sweet. I can even date it approximately. Copyright 1977 on the box.

Norton India / Soft Arkansas 6" Bench


View attachment 164748

View attachment 164749
View attachment 164750


View attachment 164751
View attachment 164752
View attachment 164753View attachment 164754

That's very cool! When my India x Washita combi arrives - you should give them a spin side by side, and see how much of a difference there is.

As I said the other day - these India x Soft Arks are still made by Norton, officially at least. Though when I had a look to see if I could buy one, they turn out to be rather difficult to track down, with lots of places being out of stock. I guess they're occasional, and quite limited, runs/releases.
 
@Desert Rat I have been wondering about the small slurry stone. It is wider than the thuri and completely a different colour.

@SirCutAlot I have got a nice edge on a W2 knife with the thuri but definitely quite hard. I want to have a play with some chisels and plane blades at some stage.
View attachment 164349View attachment 164351View attachment 164352

The large black slate looks to have been cut down at different times as there is 3 types of cut marks on it, I'm thinking it's been around for a while. It seems harder than the thuri but I need to have some more play time with it. I need some scissor finishing stones so these are all going into the collection.
View attachment 164345View attachment 164346View attachment 164347View attachment 164348
I'm hoping to get some washita's soon! (might be SiC though)
I have no idea what the small stone is. It's interesting though.

I suspect the Thuri will put a wonderful edge on chisels and plane blades. 👍
 

Latest posts

Back
Top