Any artisan J-knives with a Kramer like blade profile

Miura knives
Find deals on amazon
Kitchen Knife Forums

Help Support Kitchen Knife Forums:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.
Chseifert

Chseifert

Active Member
Joined
Nov 13, 2020
Messages
39
Reaction score
24
Location
Denmark
I’m so fond of the Kramer blade profile, that it’s my preferred blade profile on a gyuto and a santoku.

Whether it’s the Kramer Meiji or Kramer Damascus, doesn’t matter, I own both and they have a fantastic blade profile.

So I wonder, if I’m the only person, who think this particular blade profile is ingenious ?

Has any artisan blacksmith kitchen knife maker from Japan made a knife series, which resembles the Kramer blade profile ?

Doesn’t have to be an exact copy of the Kramer knife profile, just a knife with a very tall blade at the heel of the knife.

I can’t see myself moving away from Kramer’s knife profile, since it’s almost perfect to me.

Cheers, Claus
 

Attachments

  • B03BA848-0118-42E4-BBA7-51E0863B4647.jpeg
    B03BA848-0118-42E4-BBA7-51E0863B4647.jpeg
    188.7 KB · Views: 76
  • A3C10567-A184-4C8D-AA66-D5602BE80C72.jpeg
    A3C10567-A184-4C8D-AA66-D5602BE80C72.jpeg
    161.4 KB · Views: 69
Taste and preference is so subjective: I can’t see myself ever go for that blade shape ever again - at least for the sizes below 10“. Nothing has ever felt more awkward in my hands than the 20cm ZKramer in 52100. I loved its tip, but the handle was waaaaaaay to chubby and the whole profile felt „off“ for me...
 
Does it have to be Japan-made? Certainly some western makers could offer that profile.
 
This is an interesting take. I have one of the original Kramer Shun 8" gyuto in SG2. I agree that the profile has some advantages, and I do like the knife, overall it is just a bit too heavy for an 8" at 308g.

Still a great knife. I might find someone to thin it a bit and bring it down to around 250g.
 
Kramers are tall at the heel with a high tip and a decent flat spot. It's hard to find all of these characteristics in a single J-knife. If you just like 'em very tall, Takedas are nice, but they have a low tip and no flat spot to speak of. The Kramers have more distal taper too. I like both profiles very much, though they're very different knives.
 
btbyrd said:
Kramers are tall at the heel with a high tip and a decent flat spot. It's hard to find all of these characteristics in a single J-knife. If you just like 'em very tall, Takedas are nice, but they have a low tip and no flat spot to speak of. The Kramers have more distal taper too. I like both profiles very much, though they're very different knives.
Click to expand...

It's not like I only like and enjoy Kramer knives and their blade profile - I just would like to see if there was any artisan from Japan, who made a knife series in the same ball park design wise as the Kramer Meiji and Damascus knives.

I own 10 Wüsthof Classic Ikon, 6-8 Zwiling Pro Oak wood, several F.Dick knives and 10 Miyabi Artisan and two Miaybi ZDP-189 Black knives too.
I'm just a fan of a tall blade profile at the heel with ample amounts of knuckle clearance.

I enjoy handle heavy knives as well as lighter knives with the balance more towards the front.

Cheers, Claus
 
There really is nothing super similar from Japanese Makers. Maybe Masashi Kobo is somewhat similar regarding the Edge Profile (height, flat spot, high tip), Also imo there really is no functional reason to limit yourself to japanese makers ;)
 
toddnmd said:
Just curious, why are you only interested in Japanese makers?
Click to expand...

Because I’m a snob.

Just kidding.
I’m actually right now in talks with an artisan knife maker from the US about ordering a custom Nakiri with an oversized wa handle in R2/SG2 steel.
But I’m mostly interested in artisans from Japan at the moment.

Cheers, Claus
 
I'm confused. Which Kramer profile are you fond of? You posted both his lines, which are quite different in practice, and for historic reasons as well. If you like what a particular maker is doing, why go looking for someone else, to make that thing who doesn't specialize in it? Sounds like you already found a winner.

If you're focused on a tall heel, maybe look into Fell knives Kitchen Knives — Fell Knives

From Japan, Takeda makes very tall knive.

Carter's work is Japanese in all but zip code, he has some similar work too.
https://www.cartercutlery.com/knives/knives/muteki/8-31-muteki-3292-chefs-by-shamus/
 
Last edited:
Kramer is the most successful and influential American knife maker there is. Not surprising that his influence is centered mainly on American makers. Please keep us posted on how this works out for you. To me it seems like insisting on a Japanese made cheeseburger or apple pie. I am sure you can find it if you look hard enough. Maybe a Japanese national that studied with Carter and then moved back to Japan?
 
I just don't see Japanese knifemakers that churn out lots of blades of their own traditional designs desiring to help produce just one fancy custom knife that follows a non-Japanese profile.
Good luck with your search in Japan. Probably easier to find a Japanese-American guy in America who makes custom knives making one for you if you really want a Japanese artisan.
 
Chuckles said:
Kramer is the most successful and influential American knife maker there is. Not surprising that his influence is centered mainly on American makers. Please keep us posted on how this works out for you. To me it seems like insisting on a Japanese made cheeseburger or apple pie. I am sure you can find it if you look hard enough. Maybe a Japanese national that studied with Carter and then moved back to Japan?
Click to expand...
This is the analogy I needed.
 
captaincaed said:
I'm confused. Which Kramer profile are you fond of? You posted both his lines, which are quite different in practice, and for historic reasons as well. If you like what a particular maker is doing, why go looking for someone else, to make that thing who doesn't specialize in it? Sounds like you already found a winner.

If you're focused on a tall heel, maybe look into Fell knives Kitchen Knives — Fell Knives

From Japan, Takeda makes very tall knive.

Carter's work is Japanese in all but zip code, he has some similar work too.
https://www.cartercutlery.com/knives/knives/muteki/8-31-muteki-3292-chefs-by-shamus/
Click to expand...

I’m looking for a more artisan look but with the same blade profile.

You’re wrong, when indicating Kramer’s VG10 Meiji line isn’t close to identical in blade profile to his Damascus SG2 line. I should know since I own both lines.
They cut in a very similar way, the SG2 line stays sharper for longer though, but his VG10 line on the other hand is a bit easier to sharpen.
The handles are the only real difference between them, not so much the VG10 (HRC 61) vs the SG2 (HRC 62-63)

I’ve already found a winner.
But I would like another artisans take on a somewhat similar blade profile, yet in another look.
Cheers, Claus
 
Chuckles said:
Kramer is the most successful and influential American knife maker there is. Not surprising that his influence is centered mainly on American makers. Please keep us posted on how this works out for you. To me it seems like insisting on a Japanese made cheeseburger or apple pie. I am sure you can find it if you look hard enough. Maybe a Japanese national that studied with Carter and then moved back to Japan?
Click to expand...

To put these knives down on burger level to create an analogy seems a bit disrespectful to Kramer’s design, but I get what you’re trying to say.

I’m not looking for a Kramer clone, just a tall blade profile, if an artisan made one.
Cheers, Claus
 
Chseifert said:
You’re wrong, when indicating Kramer’s VG10 Meiji line isn’t close to identical in blade profile to his Damascus SG2 line. I should know since I own both lines.
They cut in a very similar way, the SG2 line stays sharper for longer though, but his VG10 line on the other hand is a bit easier to sharpen.
The handles are the only real difference between them, not so much the VG10 (HRC 61) vs the SG2 (HRC 62-63)
Click to expand...

Fair enough. I remember the original designs, it's definitely possible they've evolved. These are the lines I'm familiar with below, and they had different profiles for me when I used them.

I wasn't aware Kramer knives now came in VG10 now, I'd love to know where they're being sold these days. Would you mind showing me?

Chseifert said:
To put these knives down on burger level to create an analogy seems a bit disrespectful to Kramer’s design, but I get what you’re trying to say.
Click to expand...

I don't think Chuckles was disrespecting Kramer or his knives, I think he was making an analogy, but that's just my read. In any case, how is it disrespectful to compare a kitchen knife to the food it's designed to prepare?

What we both mean to say, is that it's often best to lean into a maker's strengths, and makers of knives like Kramer's are likely quite rare in Japan, as you've noticed. Hopefully the two Japanese alternatives I mentioned are worth looking into.




1606938434592.png

1606938444277.png
 
captaincaed said:
Fair enough. I remember the original designs, it's definitely possible they've evolved. These are the lines I'm familiar with below, and they had different profiles for me when I used them.

I wasn't aware Kramer knives now came in VG10 now, I'd love to know where they're being sold these days. Would you mind showing me?



I don't think Chuckles was disrespecting Kramer or his knives, I think he was making an analogy, but that's just my read. In any case, how is it disrespectful to compare a kitchen knife to the food it's designed to prepare?

What we both mean to say, is that it's often best to lean into a maker's strengths, and makers of knives like Kramer's are likely quite rare in Japan, as you've noticed. Hopefully the two Japanese alternatives I mentioned are worth looking into.




View attachment 105011
View attachment 105012
Click to expand...

I bought them on a Danish shop, but google is your friend:

https://www.cutleryandmore.com/search?q=kramer+meiji
 

Attachments

  • 1606940037565.png
    1606940037565.png
    834.6 KB · Views: 29
Last edited:
I have a huge amount of respect for Kramer. I think the disconnect here is in underestimating the level of respect I have for cheeseburgers. I have made a career and living out of respecting cheeseburgers.

Not trying to derail the thread. I don’t have the answer to this mystery but am 100% interested in the outcome. Best knife oriented thread going right now for me.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Latest posts

Back
Top