Quantcast

Is it true that purists favor shirogami over aogami(super)?

Kitchen Knife Forums

Help Support Kitchen Knife Forums:

M1k3

That right angle choil triggers me
Supporting Member
Joined
Jul 28, 2018
Messages
4,837
Reaction score
5,948
Guys im still here.

Firstly, here is the definition of purist "a person who insists on absolute adherence to traditional rules or structures, especially in language or style"

Secondly im not asking of opinions on purists in general, or creating a debate if being a purist have any real world value.

My question is simply what steel purists seems to favor.
I prefer iron and carbon in my steel. Sometimes some vanadium, tungsten, chromium. Molybdenum and cobalt occasionally. Manganese is known to show up a lot. Niobium is a new one on the block.
 
  • Like
Reactions: ian

ian

Supporting Member
Joined
Dec 18, 2017
Messages
3,921
Reaction score
6,813
Location
Boston, MA
Guys im still here.

Firstly, here is the definition of purist "a person who insists on absolute adherence to traditional rules or structures, especially in language or style"

Secondly im not asking of opinions on purists in general, or creating a debate if being a purist have any real world value.

My question is simply what steel purists seems to favor.
Real purists use iron knives, not steel. (And +1 to @McMan’s comment about industrially produced steels.)

In my experience, many people who quote the dictionary definition when people ask them to clarify don’t really understand what question they are asking...

Edit: Sorry, I feel like I’m getting too salty with age. I guess it’s true that you can fetishize the purity of simple carbon steels like Shirogami, so maybe if you like that sort of thing you will tend toward Shirogami. Probably most people here appreciate steels for their qualities in use, rather than for the romance of it all. The exception may be the people buying tamagahane, but I can’t speak for them...
 
Last edited:

Nagakin

Supporting Member
Joined
Jan 15, 2020
Messages
446
Reaction score
504
Location
Seattle
There's a lot of vitriol about shirogami preference. I wouldn't say it's a purist thing, but here's my take as somebody who slices sashimi all day: no matter what, I'm sharpening every day. Which steel gets to an acceptable level of sharpness the quickest? In my experience white 1 is the way to go.

I think y'all be shocked at how little time the average Japanese chef likes to spend sharpening their knife, even when they do it daily.
This is why I prefer shiro when working tweezer food. It's not really necessary, but the morning touch-up does help make me care more when every cut has to be precise. Super and PMs are for when I'm a kitchen plow.
 

nakiriknaifuwaifu

Senior Member
Joined
Jul 28, 2020
Messages
484
Reaction score
1,001
Location
Atlanta
If you haven't replaced your teeth with honyaki tamahagane dentures are you really a purist?

lol
In any case, white, blue, PM - they're all factory made steels by Hitachi company. Sure white 1 is the "purest" metallurgically speaking of those steels commonly used in knives, but what you may consider "purists" generally go for tamahagane honyaki. And generally the knives that are tamahagane honyaki are made of steel that didn't make the cut for Japanese swords, so...

:dancingcow:
 
Last edited:

mcwcdn

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 23, 2020
Messages
71
Reaction score
39
Location
canada
White and Blue are wonderful steels in the hands of a competent maker. I think most “purists” or collectors would make sure to have at least one of each in their collection.
 

Michi

Supporting Member
Joined
Jan 13, 2019
Messages
3,357
Reaction score
4,734
Location
Brisbane, Australia
White is (marginally) easier to sharpen and (maybe) takes a (slightly) sharper edge than blue. And blue (maybe) holds its edge (a little) longer.

And any of these differences get swamped quite easily by how I was feeling the day I sharpened. One day, knife A (white) is sharper than knife B (blue); another day, it is the other way around.

I have a personal preference for blue simply because it is slightly less prone to rusting.
 

Gregmega

Senior Member
Joined
Apr 12, 2017
Messages
1,378
Reaction score
1,964
Location
Los Angeles
This is why I prefer shiro when working tweezer food. It's not really necessary, but the morning touch-up does help make me care more when every cut has to be precise. Super and PMs are for when I'm a kitchen plow.
Well said.

I always preferred white in pro environs because cause the edge just feels a bit more alive to me, while blue seemed a bit cold- just preference. And when I was cooking full time, a carried a leather strop box and an aizu for quick touch ups. Now I’m older, retired early from the fine dining fantasy, and idgaf as long as it’s sharp af.
 

tchan001

Senior Member
Joined
Mar 25, 2014
Messages
823
Reaction score
1,698
Location
Hong Kong
Purists always send their knives back to the maker to be sharpened so the geometry is always exactly what the maker envisions.
 

inferno

( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
Joined
Jan 11, 2018
Messages
3,060
Reaction score
1,598
Location
(⌐■_■)
personally i think white steels suck a$$, and i only have 1 single blade made out it for that simple reason. blue 2 on the other hand, thats a really nice steel. i'd say for me its the best carbon. its gets so sharp, and its easy to get there, and it keeps it for quite a while too. blue2 is the real "supersteel" imo.
 

ModRQC

OhNoNyaki
Supporting Member
Joined
Oct 16, 2019
Messages
1,816
Reaction score
1,633
Location
QC, CA
personally i think white steels suck a$$, and i only have 1 single blade made out it for that simple reason. blue 2 on the other hand, thats a really nice steel. i'd say for me its the best carbon. its gets so sharp, and its easy to get there, and it keeps it for quite a while too. blue2 is the real "supersteel" imo.
your total hate of White is but only awkward as your reproachless respect of cryod AUS-8 😜

Really I love your bluntness, keep it up! We sure do not need any more sheeps around here than there already is.
 

inferno

( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
Joined
Jan 11, 2018
Messages
3,060
Reaction score
1,598
Location
(⌐■_■)
yeah i just dont see whats good with white steels. blue does everything white does but better, everything is better.

aus 8 is really good imo. at least when mac does it.

vg10 is also very good. i have a hattori and shiki in this steel. both are superb.

i guess i'm the antipurist here. i just want stuff thats good. and i know when i see it.
 

lemeneid

TFTFTFTFTF
Joined
Mar 31, 2018
Messages
1,220
Reaction score
1,391
Location
SG
White is (marginally) easier to sharpen and (maybe) takes a (slightly) sharper edge than blue. And blue (maybe) holds its edge (a little) longer.

And any of these differences get swamped quite easily by how I was feeling the day I sharpened. One day, knife A (white) is sharper than knife B (blue); another day, it is the other way around.

I have a personal preference for blue simply because it is slightly less prone to rusting.
I don’t buy this white is easier to sharpen stuff. It’s only marginally easier. To me it’s still the thinness of the edge which matters when it comes to sharpness.

Main thing is get your edge thin enough, and sharpening will be easy, regardless of steel, even HAP40 and ZDP.
 

Michi

Supporting Member
Joined
Jan 13, 2019
Messages
3,357
Reaction score
4,734
Location
Brisbane, Australia
I don’t buy this white is easier to sharpen stuff. It’s only marginally easier.
Yes. As I said:
White is (marginally) easier to sharpen and (maybe) takes a (slightly) sharper edge than blue.
Main thing is get your edge thin enough, and sharpening will be easy, regardless of steel, even HAP40 and ZDP.
I find HAP-40 and ZDP-189 not as easy to sharpen as white or blue. It takes a bit more time, but is nowhere near as terrible as some people claim. When I sharpen those steels, I get to meditate for maybe an extra five minutes or so :)
 
Last edited:

knspiracy

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 18, 2020
Messages
160
Reaction score
103
Location
Oz
When your edge is screaming it's impossible to tell which is sharper. They all melt hair and cigarette paper and capsicum skin.
Blue and white 2 come up quite quickly on the stone for me. Blue super takes longer to sharpen but lasts all week at work without a touch up.
 

Carl Kotte

Senior Member
Joined
Apr 5, 2019
Messages
2,698
Reaction score
4,508
Location
Stockholm, Sweden
I don’t buy this white is easier to sharpen stuff. It’s only marginally easier. To me it’s still the thinness of the edge which matters when it comes to sharpness.

Main thing is get your edge thin enough, and sharpening will be easy, regardless of steel, even HAP40 and ZDP.
If it’s marginally easier, it’s easier. 🤓
 

NO ChoP!

Old Head
Joined
Apr 11, 2011
Messages
2,821
Reaction score
701
Location
North Carolina
I think one should match the steel with the style of technique. I have a knife in hand dozens of hours a week, yet I have a very light touch, utilizing the draw. Now if you're a board clunker, white steel is probably not for you.

Also, It is said white is easier to sharpen, but in reality it is easier to screw up. When just a few steady passes are needed, one may go to town and melt away precious metal, leaving a thick bevel.
 
Last edited:

Latest posts

Top