I've worn out my Idahone ceramic honing rod after two years use. Can it be resurfaced?

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inferno said:
bobby try to do edge leading strokes in the future. i think its better. edge trailing will always leave some kind of burr folding over the other side.

i never do any kind of trailing on stones either. it just sucks. and never on belt grinders either. if an edge is what i want that is. and i've been working around industrial grinders since i was 15. and even then i found out it has to be edge leading to get less burrs.
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On the Böker LongLife I use in some emergency cases, my last strokes are 'sur place', along the edge, to catch the last burr remnants. Normal strokes are as light as possible, edge leading, but do already create a burr. Edge trailing creates an unnecessary big one.
 
Bobby2shots said:
Yeah, I may try that at one point. I bought a bunch of SiC powder for deglazing my low-grit Shapton Glass stones, specifically the 120, 220, and 320. I've got the Shapton Diamond Glass Lapping plate, but as Shapton states, that plate can't be used on anything below 500 Grit.

That said, I believe that in a de-glazing operation, the SiC might work, but,,,, I'm not de-glazing the ceramic rod. It has zero loading,,, clean as a whistle.
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the plate can probably be used on whatever stone you want but you will wear it out pretty quickly. basically diamond plates dont like coarse stones since the grit is so coarse it will dislodge the diamonds.
 
Benuser said:
On the Böker LongLife I use in some emergency cases, my last strokes are 'sur place', along the edge, to catch the last burr remnants. Normal strokes are as light as possible, edge leading, but do already create a burr. Edge trailing creates an unnecessary big one.
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That has not been my experience so far with the Vic. I sometimes vary the honing angle by what would seem to be a rather extreme amount,,, somewhat akin to what Cliff Stamp (R.I.P.) suggested with his "plateau sharpening" method. I've only needed to do that once,,,, maybe twice, since I bought the knife in November, 2018. That involves a very low angle on the side of the apex, followed by a very light stroke at 45 degrees or more across the top of the apex, then back to the side of the bevel for finishing. Worked surprisingly well.
 
inferno said:
the plate can probably be used on whatever stone you want but you will wear it out pretty quickly. basically diamond plates dont like coarse stones since the grit is so coarse it will dislodge the diamonds.
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Yeah, My plan was to buy the SG120, 220 and 320 for successively deglazing/flattening each other,,,, then SiC powder for the 120. There's also the 3-stone method; Example; three 120's for flattening each other.
 
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Bobby2shots said:
Yeah, My plan was to buy the SG120, 220 and 320 for successively deglazing/flattening each other,,,, then SiC powder for the 120. There's also the 3-stone method; Example; three 120's for flattening each other.
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if youre smart this is what you should do:

get a 120 and 220 pro. then a 500 double thick glass.
the 120 and 220 are real coarse stones. the 500 is for regular worn knives.

now to maintain these 2 coarse stones you just put the knife where the stone is not dished, where it sticks up. and then voila its flat again. these stones wear so fast so you can basically direct where the wear is going. got it? no flattening will ever be needed.

i have the 120 and 220 pro, then the 220 glass. and my strategy is basically to not ever flatten them. i just leave the slurry on there and work the slurry. doing this is what keeps them cutting.
its basically 10 minutes regular sharpening and then 10 minutes on the sides only. and to be honest you dont need more flat than that. its flat enough. and if doing edges only the stone can look like fukn half pipe for snowboards! dont waste your stone.

i have gound out 2 62-63hrc monosteel single bevel blades with the 220, never flattened it. still the bevel is 100% flat. and the back side is mirror flat too. i cant say its 1/6 lambda flat (wavelenght @ 535 nanometer flat, how you judge optical mirrors for telescopes) but still its totally flat. its the indian not the arrow! never forget.

kr%C3%B6samaja5-jpg.70702


the thread My first knife
 
I've heard edge leading strokes on leather are better for burr reduction too ;)
 
How do you keep from cutting your leather or shaving it?

I would think it would be pretty dangerous on a power tool felt or leather.
 
inferno said:
if youre smart this is what you should do:

get a 120 and 220 pro. then a 500 double thick glass.
the 120 and 220 are real coarse stones. the 500 is for regular worn knives.



kr%C3%B6samaja5-jpg.70702


the thread My first knife
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I already have the SG 120, 220, 320, 500, 1k, 2k, 4k, and 8k. plus a Naniwa Green Brick, and a Norton 4-stone kit (220,1k,4k, 8k) plus a few Atoma and more, plus three flattening plates.(Large Naniwa, smaller Norton, and Shapton DGLP). I have been considering adding a few of the Shapton Pro's for quite some time, but I just can't justify those for the time being. I'm overloaded.
 
I have not been able to duplicate the velvety matte factory finish of the Idahone Fine Rod using silicon carbide lapping on other ceramics, such as an Idahone Fine bench stone. I have a suspicion that the Fine Rod finish may be produced though chemical etching or fine abrasive blasting.
 
Mr.Wizard said:
I have not been able to duplicate the velvety matte factory finish of the Idahone Fine Rod using silicon carbide lapping on other ceramics, such as an Idahone Fine bench stone. I have a suspicion that the Fine Rod finish may be produced though chemical etching or fine abrasive blasting.
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Yeah, abrasion of any kind seems rather counter productive. The rod will wear just as any stone would, and I just have to accept that. I'm ordering another one though, because I do like how this rod performs, and it's so handy.
 
coxhaus said:
How do you keep from cutting your leather or shaving it?

I would think it would be pretty dangerous on a power tool felt or leather.
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Hhhmmm. Idk I guess it just took some practice, but mostly it just came naturally to me.




(It was just a joke)
 
For others who might consider getting a ceramic rod: I don't know the Idahone, but the synthetic rubin Sieger LongLife, distributed by Böker, does not wear as far as I have noticed. Leaves a 2k-like result. Two sizes. I have the long one, but don't know why the much cheaper short one wouldn't do the job, even with long blades.
 
Benuser said:
For others who might consider getting a ceramic rod: I don't know the Idahone, but the synthetic rubin Sieger LongLife, distributed by Böker, does not wear as far as I have noticed. Leaves a 2k-like result. Two sizes. I have the long one, but don't know why the much cheaper short one wouldn't do the job, even with long blades.
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That looks interesting Benuser, thanks for that tip. I'll check it out in the morning.
 
Bobby2shots said:
Yeah, abrasion of any kind seems rather counter productive. The rod will wear just as any stone would, and I just have to accept that. I'm ordering another one though, because I do like how this rod performs, and it's so handy.
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Since you will be replacing it perhaps you could experiment on the worn out rod, like etching with phosphoric acid?
 
I'm definitely going to hang on to the old one for the time being, and keep it as a quasi burnisher . I just ordered a new one from PaulsFinest, so that should arrive mid-week. I also threw in a few other items with that order; Felco pruners and shears, plus a holster,,,,, just in time for harvesting fresh tomatoes from my garden. Looks like a super crop this year.
 
I;ve got a small sand-blaster,,,, somewhere. I've never used it. I doubt it would do much good.

I've got to find out how this rod is made, and whether a thin abrasive layer is simply applied and adhered onto the surface of the rod, or,,,,,, is the rod and abrasive one solid material through and through (like a stone) which would allow for some surface wear,,, and simultaneously exposing a new surface as it wears.
 
Well I'll be damned,,,, and,,, I may have to eat my words. The old rod seems to be working quite well today, thank-you-very-much.

My new rod had just arrived in the mail this morning, and when I unpacked it and checked the surface of that new rod, I found there was no appreciable difference with my old rod, Hmmm,

So,,,,, today I was making a breakfast sandwich and needed to cut some thin tomato slices, and lo and behold, the 6" Vic utility knife I was using had finally dulled just enough over the last week or so, to the point where it did not instantly bite into the tomato skin. Perfect time to test the old rod again. So,,,, I dug out my old rod ,, gave the Vic a few trailing-edge swipes, noticed that the rod was showing traces of loading again, and therefore was actually removing material and sharpening, and voila,,, success. The knife cut that tomato like a razor blade. Back in the saddle again, now with 2 Idahone ceramic rods.:)

I have no idea why.o_O Last week when I first posted this thread, the rod simply was not removing metal.

Go figure.
1626899079697.png
 
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Puzzled - we've pretty much the same ceramic rod (which, BTW, has a ceramic coating over a metallic core), and after 20+ years it's showing some wear, but is still perfectly usable as a hone. We hone as a final step before stropping, taking 10 alternate strokes (20 total), with each stroke into the edge, running from heel to tip at whatever angle seems best for each blade.

From time to time the honing rod shows silver/grey streaks which we assume are removed blade material - which gets gently washed away with warm water and dish soap applied with a <plastic> (not steel wool) pad. A few minutes of cleaning appears to remove all the metallic fragments and whatever burnishing the rod has taken, and the rod's surface now has the same slightly matte finish as when new.
 
OK,,, good to know about ceramic coating over metal. Thanks and much appreciated.

As I mentioned earlier, I generally need only 3-4 very gentle trailing-edge strokes when honing my Vic utility knife. I clean the rod with the Superaser, which works exceptionally well compared to everything else I've tried. I've never allowed this knife to get dull, and I'm on it immediately if it even starts to show signs of losing cutting efficiency.

I should also mention that I sometimes use the rod as a quasi "feeler-gauge" , by dragging the rod very gently along either side of the bevel, to detect the slightest trace of the edge rolling over. A gentle grip on the rod allows the rod to transmit any vibrations from contact with deformities along the edge, directly to the hand, and that shows me fairly precisely which areas along the blade require special attention. Seems to work well for me.
 
Update,,, (scratching my head on this one);

OK,,, so I ordered a new "fine" ceramic rod from Paul'sFinest.com and received it last week. That said, I haven't needed to use it,,,,yet. It seems that the old rod is now working fine.:eek: The rod still feels much smoother than when it was new, but it is definitely removing metal once again.

As for the Vic knife, I went for roughly 2 weeks using one of my honing steels, but wasn't really getting the results I wanted with very ripe tomatoes. I was starting to think my experiment was coming to an end, and that I'd shortly need to re-sharpen the Vic on stones. I continued using the Idahone despite the fact that I could not see any traces of that rod removing metal. After roughly 5 days, I started seeing the rod very gradually improving. The gritty "feel" still wasn't back to normal, but it was definitely removing metal. (dark traces on the white rod)

Yesterday, I decided to make a breakfast sandwich (egg, sharp cheddar, tomato, lettuce, mayo on toast) I used a very large and verrrry ripe tomato that I had picked in my garden last week,,, very soft to the touch. The Vic bit into that soft-skinned tomato like a razor blade and I'm at a loss to explain why. The knife seemed to cut as if it were brand new again. So,,,, it looks like the experiment continues.

In the last two weeks, the only thing I did differently, was stropping the blade on my leather strop. A few (3-4) passes on each side. Each time I did that, the knife was razor-sharp with immediate bite into tomato skins. When the knife was at its' worst, it still cut tomatoes reasonably well. however, it was not "immediate" bite on the first stroke. It sometimes took 2-3 strokes.
 
Bobby2shots said:
Update,,, (scratching my head on this one);

OK,,, so I ordered a new "fine" ceramic rod from Paul'sFinest.com and received it last week. That said, I haven't needed to use it,,,,yet. It seems that the old rod is now working fine.:eek: The rod still feels much smoother than when it was new, but it is definitely removing metal once again.

As for the Vic knife, I went for roughly 2 weeks using one of my honing steels, but wasn't really getting the results I wanted with very ripe tomatoes. I was starting to think my experiment was coming to an end, and that I'd shortly need to re-sharpen the Vic on stones. I continued using the Idahone despite the fact that I could not see any traces of that rod removing metal. After roughly 5 days, I started seeing the rod very gradually improving. The gritty "feel" still wasn't back to normal, but it was definitely removing metal. (dark traces on the white rod)

Yesterday, I decided to make a breakfast sandwich (egg, sharp cheddar, tomato, lettuce, mayo on toast) I used a very large and verrrry ripe tomato that I had picked in my garden last week,,, very soft to the touch. The Vic bit into that soft-skinned tomato like a razor blade and I'm at a loss to explain why. The knife seemed to cut as if it were brand new again. So,,,, it looks like the experiment continues.

In the last two weeks, the only thing I did differently, was stropping the blade on my leather strop. A few (3-4) passes on each side. Each time I did that, the knife was razor-sharp with immediate bite into tomato skins. When the knife was at its' worst, it still cut tomatoes reasonably well. however, it was not "immediate" bite on the first stroke. It sometimes took 2-3 strokes.
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Is the strop loaded with anything?
 
Wonder how you know what compound? I had an old manual strop that came with green compound but my new stropping leather belt for my Ken Onion came with white compound.
 
coxhaus said:
Wonder how you know what compound? I had an old manual strop that came with green compound but my new stropping leather belt for my Ken Onion came with white compound.
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Same way you can tell if its Forged vs. Stamped. You cant. Apparently no one even knows. Not even the manufacturer.
 
O.K, ,,,, I may be on to something here;

1st, there's the Idahone rod losing its' grit and cutting ability, which directly reduced the sharpness of the knife. Why/how did that happen? Is it possible that the "pores" of the honing rod somehow became clogged with something that wasn't visible? After-all, I had thoroughly cleaned the rod with the Superaser, and SOS?

Enter the strop,,,,,,

Is it possible that the waxy green honing compound left a fine/clear/invisible residue on the knife, then in turn clogging the surface of the honing rod when I used it on the knife???

Hmmm
 
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