Stiff heavier stainless suji that won't break the bank?

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Jovidah

Jovidah

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So here's my reasoning:
-I vastly prefer stiff & heavier for my sujis because I mostly use as slicers. Really loving my Mazaki in that regard.
-I'm looking for something fully stainless specifically for the cooked meats. It's no problem to use carbon for the raw stuff, but when I'm having dinner... I'd like to be able to leave the knife dirty on the board for a few hours and not end up with it getting dirty as all hell. What I have now does not take too kindly to that.
-I really don't want to waste a fortune on this since I don't use slicers all that often... if anything this is a luxury purchase, but one I don't want to splurge on.
-Most of the cheaper sujis are all in the 'thin & light' category.
-I am EU based so... that limits things a lot.
-So the best I could come up with so far is that K&S has the Sukenari SG2 hairline slim K-tip gyuhiki fairly cheap right now... You can get a 270x48 @ 202 gr for what I consider an acceptable price (233 euros but w/o shipping or import shenanigans).

Anyone have any thoughts or opinions? It's a bit of a long shot but did anyone actually try one of those low-blade height k-tip Sukenari knives? Any other options I should look at?
 
Yea I did look into western handled fare. The problem is that while they might look heavier on paper, the weight is all in the handle. The actual blade doesn't have that much more weight to it. So a 200 gram wa handle knife actually has a substantially heavier blade than a 200 gram yo handle knife, and the 200 gram yo handle is probably quite similar in blade weight to a 140 gram wa-handle.
Although that does remind me that I have a dirt cheap Arcos 250 chef's knife that's actually in that 45-50mm tall range and is stainless. Hmm... maybe I should just get myself a saya or something for that so it can become a travel slicer...
 
You mention that absolute weight can be thrown off by differences in handle type; is there a specific minimum spine width that you have in mind?
 
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The only thicker cheaper long stainless knives I know are western deba. If you could force a dark patina it would work fine for carbon. Also consider a stainless yanagi, whether molybdenum or VG 10 or ginsan -- those will get the desired thickness of blade
 
IMG_6041.jpeg

A long gyuto may be in order. This is a 360 cow sword from yamasuke. Think i paid around $100 for it. Its carbon but trust me you can leave it out for hours at a time. This is after many drinks and food with no rust. It goes through raw and cooked protien with ease. Never had a problem with food sticking either. The 360 sukenisa at jns might be worth checking out.
 
HumbleHomeCook said:
What about a simple Dexter Russell butcher knife?

https://www.dexterrussellcutlery.com/dexter-russell-sani-safe-12-butcher-knife-4113-s112-12-pcp/
That guy is around 240g.
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Yeah I've thought about this... there's plenty of similar Victorinox stuff that really doesn't cost much. If I didn't have anything yet and needed something for processing raw stuff I think this would actually be an option I'd consider... but psychologically I just have a problem with taking a plastic handled knife to the table to cut high quality meat. It just takes any enjoyment or feeling of luxury out of the experience. It's like eating sushi out of a bright pink Hello Kitty lunchbox... ;)
Qapla' said:
You mention that absolute weight can be thrown off by differences in handle type; is there a specific minimum spine width that you have in mind?
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Not really? Just want it to be stiff and bladeforward. Basically a stainless Mazaki. :D And taper is actually a downside. That's why that Sukenari came floating to the surface; it's not really thick, but because they barely have any taper and the K-tip holds a taller profile for longer it actually ends up being somewhat in that stiff & blade forward ballpark. At least that's what I hoped.
thebradleycrew said:
https://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/threads/catcheside-sujihiki-305mm-bnib.67184/
This would not disappoint but might be on the pricier end of what you are looking for.
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Yeah that's just way too much for me. Probably also too long? I think more than 270 just doesn't make sense to me. But if I had 500+ to splurge on this I'd probably just end up barking up the HSC or Sicard tree to make me something custom.
refcast said:
The only thicker cheaper long stainless knives I know are western deba. If you could force a dark patina it would work fine for carbon. Also consider a stainless yanagi, whether molybdenum or VG 10 or ginsan -- those will get the desired thickness of blade
Click to expand...
Actually I never looked into western debas... who knows it might actually tick the boxes! Won't a yanagi be too much of a hassle for someone like me who never used or sharpened single bevels and has no experience with countering the steering on a knife like that? In the end it's still a knife I wouldn't use all that often.
 
Jovidah said:
Not really? Just want it to be stiff and bladeforward. Basically a stainless Mazaki. :D And taper is actually a downside. That's why that Sukenari came floating to the surface; it's not really thick, but because they barely have any taper and the K-tip holds a taller profile for longer it actually ends up being somewhat in that stiff & blade forward ballpark. At least that's what I hoped.
Click to expand...
I can't answer that directly because I have no experiences with Mazaki's, but do you think a Hattori would be a valid choice?

https://japanesechefsknife.com/coll...ies-sujihiki-230mm-9-inch?variant=29965857475
Jovidah said:
Yeah that's just way too much for me. Probably also too long? I think more than 270 just doesn't make sense to me. But if I had 500+ to splurge on this I'd probably just end up barking up the HSC or Sicard tree to make me something custom.
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In the Netherlands I'm aware of Hardent Knives, but I know nothing about them.
 
Qapla' said:
I can't answer that directly because I have no experiences with Mazaki's, but do you think a Hattori would be a valid choice?

https://japanesechefsknife.com/coll...ies-sujihiki-230mm-9-inch?variant=29965857475

In the Netherlands I'm aware of Hardent Knives, but I know nothing about them.
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I think Hattori is also in that 'thin and light' category? It just looks heavier than it is because of western handle, with micarta making it even heavier.
But I've always had a softspot for them since they're one of the few mono VG10 knives, and they handles look really nice.
On the other hand, it always REALLY irks me that even now in 2023 they're still sellling them with the old KF logo...yes...they're still printing on a logo of a forum that hasn't existed anymore for at least 10 years.
 
Oh XD

Maybe a stainless euro knife could work too. Those have thick spines. Sabatiers particularly, but old German ones too. Steel might not be the best.

Yeah yanagi need some user input to know how to operate and sharpen

You'd need to thin the western deba behind the edge, but it definitely has the meat and weight you desire
 
Yeah I'm actually starting to think 'cheap European' isnt even such a bad idea here. My cheap Arcos 250x45 actually ticks the boxes better than most sujis would.
Steel quality isn't really that relevant since it's an occasional home-use kinda thing. So as long as it's stainless it's fine, anything more than that is overkill. I'm not going to be slicing roasts for 300 people.
The catch on the western debas that I found is that none of the affordable ones come in at more than 240mm.

I think this is a unique landmark in KKF history. At the start of this thread I was looking for confirmation for the Sukenari - or some alternative. At the end of it I walk away reconsidering stuff that's actually CHEAP and stuff that I already have. :D
 
Jovidah said:
I think this is a unique landmark in KKF history. At the start of this thread I was looking for confirmation for the Sukenari - or some alternative. At the end of it I walk away reconsidering stuff that's actually CHEAP and stuff that I already have.
Click to expand...

Can't let that stand....

One of my favorite suji over the years was a Heiji carbon. Weighed in around 220g which is great weight for long cutting sessions, anything over 200g would be fine for home application. Concur that 270mm is a good length for a suji, whether for home or pro use.

The Sukenari you described up top would probably be a good solution as well. Sounds like it ticks all boxes.

Disagree that a Euro blade, DR type or longer gyuto can serve the purpose well. Yuck.

Pls send a report on the Sukenari after you've put it through it's paces...
 
That really looks like a poor man's single bevel. Which might be the ticket for someone who actually wants to do low budget sashimi... but I don't really care for any-budget sashimi. :D
I decided to resist the urge... replaced my 25 year old freezer instead. It's not like I can't slice a few big roasts a year with the existing assortment of 270 and 240 gyutos and sujihikis. Might just be better off keeping an eye on BST and snapping up a bargain there... as an older member I shall not neglect my duties of preying on new members like a circling shark!
 
Benuser said:
https://japanesechefsknife.com/products/fujiwara-kanefusa-fkm-series-danbiki-knifeHaven't used it myself. Nice about the Fujiwara Kanefusa is the price that hardly varies between the different lengths.
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Poor man here.

I was in the exact same situation as you, wanted to try a cheap Suji and one of these showed up for 75 on bst. I bought it, I like it okay, use it for slicing raw fish, I usually use a gyuto for roasts but it scratched my itch, I’m no longer Suji curious.

I’d recommend this as a valid answer to your original question.
 
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If it was just suji curiosity it might have been even easier to justify... but I already have 2 270 sujis... just figured I'd kinda like to have one that's stainless. And I'm still somewhat 240-suji curious.
But damnit I talked myself out of it so I'll stick to it... for now. ;)
 
I actually considered putting my 210 Ashi wa-petty for sale a while back when I discovered something even better for trimming meats.... until I realized it's my new favorite potato knife. Just can't see myself letting it go.
 
Jovidah said:
I actually considered putting my 210 Ashi wa-petty for sale a while back when I discovered something even better for trimming meats.... until I realized it's my new favorite potato knife. Just can't see myself letting it go.
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What is a potato knife? Just curious.
 
Ruso said:
What is a potato knife? Just curious.
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It's what I use to prep my potatos... which 90% of the time I cut into ~1cm cubes using a combination of draw cuts and pushcuts / chops. Somehow the Ashi became my perfect solution for it. Quick, nimble, little stickage due to low profile, easy to do quick fast drawcuts with. It just works...
 
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