Jovidah
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As far as I know all the straight wall pans from DeMeyere are disc bottoms... you want fully clad you'll need to get something with slanted / curved sidewalls.
High end frying pan recommendation
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user 16756
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I do not believe you are correct. My recollection is the Industry5 saucepans are fully clad.
Zwilling themselves says that it is 5 ply construction "all the way to the rim", that doesnt sound like disk bottom to me.
Jovidah
I'll make you a sponsor offer you can't refuse...
Interesting, looks like you're right. Kinda atypical since what I said was pretty much how DeMeyere used to advertise it themselves (because in their opinion this distinction led to the best performance for both types of pans).
It is confusing. I spent all day looking at pans. I still don't know what I want. I was originally thinking a saute' pan or small fry pan with even heating and fast reaction time on both heat up cool down using gas.
user 16756
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all-clad d3. relatively cheap, light enough to be responsive, relatively even heating, tough as nails.
steel lined copper obviously is the best fit nominally but you have to want to put up with that.
Pro line is the brand name for high end skillets. They’re clad, but much more deluxe than all clad
Atlantis lines up with proline but it’s a super thick disk base. Fissler is the closest direct competitor to Atlantis, I think they’re more bang for the buck
Atlantis lines up with proline but it’s a super thick disk base. Fissler is the closest direct competitor to Atlantis, I think they’re more bang for the buck
Jovidah
I'll make you a sponsor offer you can't refuse...
Not all Atlantis pans are disk bottoms though; the curved conical saute / saucier pans are clad pans, not disk bottoms. At least they're consistently inconsistent. 
I think you're right on the proline thing; only ever saw skillets with that name.
I think you're right on the proline thing; only ever saw skillets with that name.
Cox, I’d give this guy a close look. Does double duty in my kitchen as a multi purpose mid size saucepan and a small sauté pan. Deep enough to braise in for small meals. One of the best pans I ever bought. Stick with the 20 cm size.
https://www.fissler.com/us/products...ofi-collection-saucepan-flat-7-9-in-with-lid/
The other alternative is get that proline skillet in 24 cm. It’s a great small skillet, I just don’t find skillets as versatile as sauté pans.
Isn't proline the same as Demeyere Atlantis pans? They both come up in google.
Demeyere Atlantis Stainless-Steel Frying Pans | Williams Sonoma (williams-sonoma.com)
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Steampunk
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I can definitely recommend Demeyere, if for no other reason than they have no rivets on the inside, and the surface finish makes them easier to clean up at the end of the day. Whether you pick an Industry (5-layer all-clad), an Atlantis (7-layer, sometimes disc bottom, sometimes all-clad.), or a John Pawson (Same as Atlantis; sometimes disc bottom, sometimes all-clad 7-layer.) you're going to get a pan with great handles, easy cleanup, and good heating characteristics. They 'just work'. If you want even heating up the sides in a skillet, you can go with any line, since all the skillets are fully-clad. If you want even heating up the sides in a saute, go with the Industry 5. The Atlantis/Pro-Line, and John Pawson are disk bottom.
Mauviel 5-layer stainless is a nice one for responsive, fast, even heating, up to very high temperatures for stainless. It's rated up to 680f, which is nice for some things. Demeyere is rated up to 500f. However, between the rivets and rougher surface finish on the inside, it's more of a PITA to clean. They do fully-clad sautes, skillets, and braisers of various sizes, which is handy. Doesn't retain heat as well as Fissler or Demeyere disc bottoms, but does respond quickly. It works more like thinner carbon steel in terms of sinking coolness out initially, and then pumps heat back into the food quickly based upon what the stove is outputting. Great for strong gas. More even heat than thin carbon, and of course non-reactive. Interesting pans. There's a learning curve, but a rewarding one.
Fissler are also easy to clean; almost as much as Demeyere. Their big aluminum disk at the base isn't the fastest to react, but it's very even, and subtle, and they hold the temperature you set them at very well. Gently searing meats, and doing low sautes in these pans are excellent. However - like any disc bottom - they wouldn't be my first choices for oven-work, or slow braises, where ECI really seems to shine. Also not my first choice for pan sauces. Demeyere Industry and Mauviel seems to be a bit more responsive and even for those. Also not my choice for stir-fry, hot/fast sort of work, where carbon rules.
I'd probably say Demeyere Industry 5 or Mauviel fits the bill described. Mauviel might react a smidge faster than Industry 5. Not always in a good way, if you're searing, and aren't pumping some serious BTU's into it. Stays even, though.
Hope this helps.
Then look at the 24cm sauté pan from fissler. I have a proline stacked on top of this pan, I constantly move the skillet out of the way to use this
https://www.fissler.com/us/products...i-collection-saute-pan-9-4-in-with-metal-lid/
Yes, I don't need a stainless pan to replace my cast iron or carbon pans. I will still use those.
Rick, that Fissler pan reminds me of my Le Creuset which are nice pans but they do not cool down very quickly.
So, nobody has tried an All-Clad copper pan? I just read a review and they say it heats up faster and cools down faster than their D3. I don't know if it is true or not. They also say the MC2 line is about the same.
Rick, that Fissler pan reminds me of my Le Creuset which are nice pans but they do not cool down very quickly.
So, nobody has tried an All-Clad copper pan? I just read a review and they say it heats up faster and cools down faster than their D3. I don't know if it is true or not. They also say the MC2 line is about the same.
McMan
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Nope. Atlantis is the heavy disk bottom. Proline is clad (7 layer).
https://www.demeyere-online.com/content/demeyere/uk/en/series/series/atlantis.htmlhttps://www.demeyere-online.com/content/demeyere/uk/en/series/frying_pans/proline.html
I had an Atlantis saucepan. Never bonded with it--this was actually the pan that turned me off from disc-bottomed pans. Sure, the disk does quite well to conduct/hold heat but the walls are so thin they create hotspots, so things that touch the wall can get scorched (think diced onions, roux, etc.). This was compounded by the fact that where the walls meet the disk is a 90-degree angle, making it even more difficult to get a utensil in that angle. I think to some extent it's a matter of taste--clad pans have their issues too--and also a matter of usage, history (more disc bottomed pans in use in Europe?), plus what variables might be most important to an individual user.
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If you want a pan that behaves like a copper pan, why not just get one?
https://www.copperpans.com/classic-frying-pan-24-cm-94-in
Falk also has a line with incased 2mm copper. Take a look for it. They describe it as mostly for induction
I may in the end order a copper pan. I think copper with 2.5 mm would work for gas. I just have to come around to polishing copper.
In the mean time I ordered an All-Clad copper 5-quart saute' pan. I could not find a smaller one in copper clad. I want to see what the All-Clad copper pan is like since nobody has tried one.
All-Clad Copper Core Deep Sauté Pan | Williams Sonoma (williams-sonoma.com)
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Do you polish all of your carbon knives? You could just let the copper patinate.
I just realized you are talking about the Copper Coeur Line which is clad 1.9 copper. Does anybody have one of these? They cost as much as a thicker copper pan that you have to polish.
Luftmensch
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Like @Nemo said... polishing isnt mandatory.
A few posts back I mentioned Essteele. I am not advocating this option but it looks vaguely close to All Clad Copper in composition. There is a nice ring of copper around the base.... you can choose to polish it... or you can choose not to. I don't. Each to their own - but the brighter the copper is, the more it sticks out like dogs bollocks. I find the patina (at least oxidisation) helps it settle in.
Most of the clad copper options mentioned here are similar in that you only get a peekaboo of copper. Some have a full surface of copper visible on the exterior. I would gladly let those patina as well. I may be just a little more careful not to spill food/oil over the sides. Seeing as the term gets bandied around a lot... wabi-sabi... right?
Do you even need anything?
Sounds like you are in 'thin' skillet territory?
Congrats
Beautiful pan. I am sure you will be happy.
I looked pretty closely at the Esstele options.
I think that the Esstele clad option is called Per Sempre and it is more like the All Clad D5 in construction: a stainless cladding around a core of 2 layers of aluminium around another layer of stainless. The middle layer of stainless makes no sense to me.
[Edit 13/8/21
n further investigation I realisehis is not actually true. See post below from today]The other Esstele stainless option is called Per Vita and has an aluminium and copper base (it's not clad per se). They don't say how thick the different layers are.
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Fair enough
Im an induction only user and have owned 6 Falk copper coeur pans for a year now. They are pretty nice with some caveats, though, and in my view the best fully clad pans on the market, still today. FWIW.
If you are a non induction user, I would steer you towards the bimetal copper pans, though, if you are after this type of pans. Get over the need of polishing etc.
On induction, for cladded pans especially, I think one should take care to pick the pan bottom size according to the hob size. No overhanging, or there can and likely will be a disappointment in evenness.
So, my 24cm Falk CC frypan gets up to heat fast and cooks rather even on my biggest hob of "21cm". The bottom of the pan is properly sized for the hob and I enjoy it there a great deal. However I often need that hob for a bigger pan when I cook for my family...
My 28cm Falk CC frypan then... it has overhang. It certainly still cooks on the outside perimeter, but if I crowd the pan, especially then I can see how it heats more in the mid sector.. and its a bit annoying, tbh..
For frypans or saute pans on induction my general preference is thick disc based / hybrid cookware. My new fave frypans are my two Lagostina Accademia pans with alu disc attached to the (thin) fully clad vessel. They heat evenly and have nice heat retention, ample frying power so to say.
I also have the Paderno GG 28cm frypan and it is mucho even, more so than the Lagostina, directly over the disc, but I like to use the Lagostina over that generally as the sidewalls are hot there too. Paderno so far has been my steak pan basically, but its a great pan for all things frying...
I know little about gas and electric... I imagine 2.5 copper being nice on a good gas burner though.
I have this specific saute pan (size seemed ideal between the too small 4qt and too big 6qt) + the skillet in copper core. I also have d3 skillets. The construction is of similar quality on copper core and d3, but the copper core pans are more responsive as expected. I can't burn anything in these pans. You just turn down the heat and the pan reacts very quickly. It also has the benefit of being light and maneuverable like the d3 gear.
My understanding is that the Demeyere pro line pans should be compared with all clad d7, not copper core even if they are both their top line. Demeyere pro line has good heat retention and heat diffusion, but is heavy. All clad copper core has good heat diffusion and is light, but poor heat retention. Your choice should depend on how you want to use the pan. I personally use cast iron or carbon steel to sear meat and so on, non stick for eggs and fish, and enameled cast iron for braise stuff. What remains is mostly veggies and acidic dishes so I picked copper core for its responsiveness and lightness.
If you don't mind not being able to use your pans on induction and having to polish from time to time, bimetal copper should perform better than anything copper clad. The Falk Copper Core line looks pretty amazing though with about double the copper thickness of all clad's copper core and almost as much copper as 2.5mm bimetal copper. Super expensive though compared to all clad's copper core line that you can easily find on sale.
Yes, hmh I like what you said. It makes me feel better about my purchase. I am looking for a responsive pan. I have many Le Creuset pans which cook very well but they are just not real responsive. I feel like the disc pans are going to be along those lines. I already have that type of pan covered. I agree on the 5-quart copper core saute' pan I think it will be a good size. I already have a USA made Viking triply 3.4-quart saute' pan that I like.
I wish I would have read your response sooner. Not knowing about the copper core pan I ordered an All-Clad LTD 10-inch fry pan to try it. There was a nice one on eBay. I guess I should have waited and bought the copper core version. I will probably sell my All-Clad D5 10-inch fry pan. The D5 is ok just nothing special. I think D5 was to work with induction well which does not help me with gas.
The other plus for All-Clad over Demeyere is the warranty. All-Clad is forever and Demeyere is 30 years.
I wish I would have read your response sooner. Not knowing about the copper core pan I ordered an All-Clad LTD 10-inch fry pan to try it. There was a nice one on eBay. I guess I should have waited and bought the copper core version. I will probably sell my All-Clad D5 10-inch fry pan. The D5 is ok just nothing special. I think D5 was to work with induction well which does not help me with gas.
The other plus for All-Clad over Demeyere is the warranty. All-Clad is forever and Demeyere is 30 years.
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@coxhaus herers a review of the all clad copper core that compares them directly to Falk. It’s most of the way down
https://therationalkitchen.com/all-clad-copper-core-cookware-worth-it/
https://therationalkitchen.com/all-clad-copper-core-cookware-worth-it/
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