Sharpening honesuki

[Pie]

How do you guys do it?

I have a pretty vanilla y. Kato that’s basically a honesuki shaped petty. It’s not particularily beefy or anything, and it’s *sigh* hollow ground and unremarkable thick/thinness at the edge.

Problem is I use it a ton, and it’s ended up with a fat edge bevel. It’s not reaaaally an issue because a little meat behind the edge ups survivability but it’s sort of annoying to touch up as it’s so thick behind the edge.

Would you guys zero it out or thin a bit behind the edge? Or say screw it and embrace the durability?

 

[ethompson]

Ease the new shoulder a bit and make it into a beefy convex bevel. Add in a micro-bevel and done. At least that’s how I treat my honesuki…

 

[HumbleHomeCook]

Ease the new shoulder a bit and make it into a beefy convex bevel. Add in a micro-bevel and done. At least that’s how I treat my honesuki…

This is basically what I did on my first one when it needed some attention.

 

[WellLikedTurtle]

A family member of mine had the same experience with their Y. Kato honesuki, I essentially suggested the same as you were thinking, leave it kinda thick if you're really using it for poultry.

@ethompson suggestion to make it a stout convex with microbevel is also an excellent idea if you've got that itch to work on it.

 

[Heckel7302]

I took my Mortaka down to zero then added a microbevel, but those knives are a different kind of beast, thick blade stock with a short bevel, so even at zero they are still 'fairly' thick BTE. Mostly I did that to expose more core steel and even out the bevels to practice polishing. For your hollow kato I'd definitely do what the others suggested, convex the edge bevel to take the out the shoulder BTE.

 

[deltaplex]

I've got a question on the one I'm refurbing for my brother. It's a masahiro, and it came to me with the flat side sharpened into a bevel for the first ~1/3. I've got to knock the heel down already, which is the lesser of two evils to get the edge straight: grind the front up so that the LH bevel is flat again and redo the rest of the profile, or grind the remaining 2/3 of the flat bevel to match the front 1/3?

 

[deltaplex]

How do you guys do it?

I have a pretty vanilla y. Kato that’s basically a honesuki shaped petty. It’s not particularily beefy or anything, and it’s *sigh* hollow ground and unremarkable thick/thinness at the edge.

Problem is I use it a ton, and it’s ended up with a fat edge bevel. It’s not reaaaally an issue because a little meat behind the edge ups survivability but it’s sort of annoying to touch up as it’s so thick behind the edge.

Would you guys zero it out or thin a bit behind the edge? Or say screw it and embrace the durability?

I'd grind the convexity out; I'm very likely to start doing this proactively on my projects that have a hollow bevel.

 

[HumbleHomeCook]

I've got a question on the one I'm refurbing for my brother. It's a masahiro, and it came to me with the flat side sharpened into a bevel for the first ~1/3. I've got to knock the heel down already, which is the lesser of two evils to get the edge straight: grind the front up so that the LH bevel is flat again and redo the rest of the profile, or grind the remaining 2/3 of the flat bevel to match the front 1/3?

Personally, I'd be inclined to just grind a full length bevel. So many of them aren't truly single anyway and have some amount of left-side bevel. But I guess it also depends on the width of the bevel that is already there and would you think it might end up being too.

 

[Cliff]

I have been working on my Masahiro, too. It came with a pretty big micro-bevel on the left side. I've been struggling to get it back to what it was from the factory, which is unusual for me. They had a great, coarse finish that just tore through things. I reduced the micro-bevel a bit and have been finishing on SP100, which has been pretty good.

 

[deltaplex]

Personally, I'd be inclined to just grind a full length bevel. So many of them aren't truly single anyway and have some amount of left-side bevel. But I guess it also depends on the width of the bevel that is already there and would you think it might end up being too.

I think it's less overall meatal removed goin this route, would probably end up as a roughly70/30 when it's all said and done

 

[Cliff]

Masahiro is more extreme than that, but there is a micro-bevel (and no ura).

 

[Pie]

Appreciate the input guys!

That’s congruent with my train of though, take the shoulder off the secondary bevel, convex it out but also maybe temp fate a little and get a bit skinny BTE.

I suck at finding the wing joints so it’ll be a good measure of how robust it is after the work. You guys might see a wtb thread in the next few days

 

[deltaplex]

I find a little wrist wiggle helps to get the edge to fall in place correctly on those, fwiw.

 

[Famima]

I totally second the @ethompson suggestion - point to note is that if you're e.g. going through soft-tissue, then it naturally parts on contact with the edge, a bit of extra thickness isn't at all noticeable unless you're getting stuck into joints/cartilage etc, where the extra robustness helps you.

 

[Famima]

I always suck at getting my honesuki sharp btw, takes a few goes to dial in the angles. Maybe that's the wrist wriggle above, lol!

 

[Pie]

I totally second the @ethompson suggestion - point to note is that if you're e.g. going through soft-tissue, then it naturally parts on contact with the edge, a bit of extra thickness isn't at all noticeable unless you're getting stuck into joints/cartilage etc, where the extra robustness helps you.

I agree, I can’t think of any reason to go significantly thinner other than ease of touch up.

Finding that angle on a fat bevel bugs me. The feedback on stones with this knife is less than amazing as well.

 

[MowgFace]

Do you mind posting a pic? Would be interesting to see a visual reference.

 

[Pie]

Do you mind posting a pic? Would be interesting to see a visual reference.

Most definitely. I’ll get some before/during/after if I don’t get too excited getting the stones out lol.

 

[Jovidah]

If you're using it as a butchering knife to take apart birds I'm not sure I'd bother a whole lot to thin it down. I never noticed a particular difference in use as long as the edge is sharp. For me half the appeal of a honesuki is that it's quick and easy to sharpen.

 

[Benuser]

If you're using it as a butchering knife to take apart birds I'm not sure I'd bother a whole lot to thin it down. I never noticed a particular difference in use as long as the edge is sharp. For me half the appeal of a honesuki is that it's quick and easy to sharpen.

You might want the tip to remain thin. Otherwise, it shouldn't matter that much. I sharpen the right side as any other knife — starting far behind the very edge. Certainly not looking for facetting, but for a convex bevel in line with the convex right face — as in any knife.

 

[Pisau]

Hi all. I'm aware that double bevel honesukis seem to be the topic, but single bevel-wise I am going to continue Myojin-san's somewhat high ko-ba of 40-ish degrees on mine. I was surprised at first by the robust edge and ootb bluntness, but after just a few minutes on the stones I found it crazy sharp. Way too sharp for chooks and work-safety lol. I reckon there's merit in having a robust edge in this case.

 

[Pie]

If you're using it as a butchering knife to take apart birds I'm not sure I'd bother a whole lot to thin it down. I never noticed a particular difference in use as long as the edge is sharp. For me half the appeal of a honesuki is that it's quick and easy to sharpen.

That’s essentially the issue at hand - touch ups are a chore on such a thick bevel. A couple swipes on a finisher works much better when the edge is already close to zero.

@MowgFace this is the bevel in question. It’s at least a millimeter wide, unacceptable for most other knives but this one gets a pass for reasons mentioned above.

Choil shot doesn’t say much, looks thin due to never really using or sharpening the heel. Started thinning yesterday, Oof. The wheel scratch finish hides a lot of iffy geometry.

 

[Pie]

Do you mind posting a pic? Would be interesting to see a visual reference.

There’s….. a lot of extra steel hanging out bte. Like a ton. I underestimated the thickness that low blade height and thick spine create. Convexed near the heel but quite flat in the front. Probably shouldn’t have done that, but hey let’s just not hit bones, right? I’m finding it difficult to apply enough pressure to grind but not enough to flex the blade.

Its super cool to visualize exactly how a grind looks by taking off metal tho. Most of the hagane has seen stone, so maybe I have a jnat shootout to see which one gives the cleanest mirror.

 

[Benuser]

What is the advantage of a more or less symmetric honesuki over the more common, strongly asymmetric one, with a flat left face?

 

[Pie]

What is the advantage of a more or less symmetric honesuki over the more common, strongly asymmetric one, with a flat left face?

I honestly don’t know. My guess is it’s a *******ization of the original design, with western users in mind.

I see no benefit other than durability.

 

[Pie]

Behold! Hack job thinning complete. Uchigumori the finisher. Frosty core under harsh light and lightly hazy. Cladding ignored in full. Aside from a nice bit where the low spot wasn’t so low.

I didn’t change the geometry much from the last time. Maybe went one deeper up the cladding while going at it on the iyoto.

Pre polish performance test was amazing. Just glides through flesh and survived some bone. A bit thin maybe near the heel. I suppose the real endpoint was how much easier it is to sharpen, and it most definitely checks that box. This knife is my black sheep, stainless clad and pretty bland overall. I can happily say it’s been substantially improved.