Why do I keep purchasing Western handle knives when I Hate them???

[RRLOVER]

I think I am I the only person with this problem or maybe not....I have some Very nice Westerns in my block that are magnificent cutters but just don't grab them...My Kamon arrived recently and the Wa handle feels so Perfect in my hand that I have only been using it in a three knife rotation....Yes all three are Wa handles...I have knives that cut better than the three in rotation but don't have that "Feels Great" in hand to me...So is anyone else willing to forgive some cutting ability for a knife the just feels really good in their hand???

 

[ethompson]

I’ve also never found a western that felt really really good in hand

 

[esoo]

To me the problem with most westerns is the balance is too far back - at the bolster, on the bolster. Just can't give with that.

That said, my ZKramer Carbon 10" balances at the pinch and feels great in hand. I don't use it a lot as it's just heavier that I generally use.

 

[stringer]

To me the problem with most westerns is the balance is too far back - at the bolster, on the bolster. Just can't give with that.

That just means the knife isn't long enough.


I'm the opposite. Only Western handles are comfortable to me for long chopping sessions. It doesn't matter for home. But if I'm doing a full day of pro cooking I'm leaving anything with a wa handle at home and bringing a flight of westerns. I can't stand the neck on wa handles. It cramps my fingers.

 

[captaincaed]

I think there’s an identity thing involved, I find myself wanting westerns but liking both. And realistically, a wa handle is far more maintainable over time. Westerns are a pain to rehandle by comparison. I like how they look. They look ‘like a knife is supposed to look’ for my brain.

In a similar metaphor, I realize nakiri cut great, solve lots of problems, do basically every task. But I don’t want my friends to catch me riding a vespa, no matter how fun it is, so I roll out the crotch rocket, even though it’s heavier and louder and more bike than I need to get around the city. A gyuto ‘looks like a real knife.’ Stupid brain.

 

[WildBoar]

Mario -- I think the only real solution is to make knives yourself...

(if you ever start up again, please put me on the list for a 225-240 stainless steel gyuto)

 

[Barmoley]

Mario -- I think the only real solution is to make knives yourself...

(if you ever start up again, please put me on the list for a 225-240 stainless steel gyuto)

I agree with this course of action and mirror the sentiment and request except that 235-245 works better for me.

I’ve lately been using more western handles, now back to WA. Both can be very comfortable and well designed western handles can even be superior for me. Western handles with tapered sides and no neck work very well. Since I like my middle finger to be against the choil in pinch grip, western handles without a neck give me more blade to work with. Balance point can also be more back because the pinch grip is not as deep and more of a handle is covered by the grip. This to some degree alleviates the tendency of western handles to be heavier.

In any case both can work, but I agree that comfort in use and handling can be more important than ultimate cutting performance as long as the better feeling knife is not terrible.

 

[ReiHamono]

Haters love to hate

 

[esoo]

That just means the knife isn't long enough.

Maybe, but for reason the still manage to mess up the balance on the longer ones.

 

[M1k3]

I'd like something like a Mazaki or Toyamanabe, but with a western handle myself.

 

[Benuser]

To me the problem with most westerns is the balance is too far back - at the bolster, on the bolster. Just can't give with that.

That said, my ZKramer Carbon 10" balances at the pinch and feels great in hand. I don't use it a lot as it's just heavier that I generally use.

Find a last NOS Nogent and you'll be amazed.

 

[blokey]

I like the balance of Ryusen

 

[esoo]

Find a last NOS Nogent and you'll be amazed.

I had a 8" at one point. Just didn't jive with it. It was a lightly flexy beast.

 

[Chang]

I’ve also never found a western that felt really really good in hand

I have a couple that might sway ya..

I started out a devout wa guy, but now I tend to only want yo handles. I'll take a wa if it's an integral (or a really hot maker)

The aesthetic, the comfort, mmmmm so tasty. But yah, worst part is the uphill battle of trying to get that forward balance.

Although, I think I've come across a solution, something I noticed Evan Antzenberger has been doin' a lot....frame western handles, like this:

 

[ethompson]

It’s not even the balance so much as they just don’t fit my damn hand nicely. Soon though I’ll find one

 

[blokey]

I have a couple that might sway ya..

I started out a devout wa guy, but now I tend to only want yo handles. I'll take a wa if it's an integral (or a really hot maker)

The aesthetic, the comfort, mmmmm so tasty. But yah, worst part is the uphill battle of trying to get that forward balance.

Although, I think I've come across a solution, something I noticed Evan Antzenberger has been doin' a lot....frame western handles, like this:

View attachment 234883View attachment 234884View attachment 234885View attachment 234886

I really like hidden tang westerns, for a different reason tho, wiping down the tang is just not something I want to do every time. Less surface exposure less worry of rust.

 

[Choppin]

I love the way yo handled knives look and keep buying them, but they rarely feel "right" to me. it's either a balance thing, or the handle is too big/small, or the handle/bolster transition isn't comfortable...

I can't even explain in some cases. I guess it's a harder handle format to "get it right" compared to wa handles which are simpler?

and yet I'm attracted to them and keep buying... the only one so far that I've liked (and kept) is my Gesshin Ginga 180 yo-gyuto. I think the added weight on an otherwise very light knife is welcome.

 

[brimmergj]

Henry Hyde does a damn good hidden tang western. He pretty much ruined wa handles for me. Most comfortable handle I've ever held. Balance is ~5 mm behind the pinch though, so I get that it wouldn't be for the blade forward folks.
I made a western for my Watanabe and now it's very blade forward. Shaved of about 30 grams from the stock ho wood wa handle. It's nice but doesn't feel as good as the Hyde

 

[blokey]

Henry Hyde does a damn good hidden tang western. He pretty much ruined wa handles for me. Most comfortable handle I've ever held. Balance is ~5 mm behind the pinch though, so I get that it wouldn't be for the blade forward folks.
I made a western for my Watanabe and now it's very blade forward. Shaved of about 30 grams from the stock ho wood wa handle. It's nice but doesn't feel as good as the Hyde

He does the semi-integral bolster thing which helps alot with the balance.

 

[Rangen]

On the one hand, yo handle knives always seem to make assumptions about the dimensions of your hand.

On the other hand, I've only ever had one handle I hated, a circular slippy Shun, so I don't make a lot of distinctions. Almost all handles seem to work fine for me. If I have a preference, it's like Choppin's. yo for small knives, wa for large knives. But I am just fine with either. Maybe a luxury of not being a pro cook who has to make a thousand cuts in a day?

 

[Barmoley]

Westerns handles that are designed to be used in pinch grip are usually fine. Often times western handles are designed with an expectation that the user will use hammer or racket grip.

 

[brimmergj]

He does the semi-integral bolster thing which helps alot with the balance.

Good point. Definitely helped with balance and comfort

 

[marc4pt0]

I think some folks get caught up in the aesthetics when designing their western handles, overlooking the function and in-hand-feel

 

[TeaThyme]

The only time I like western handles is on a short petty when you want to use it for in-hand work only. I once bought a Takamura 130 petty. I tried it and loved it. Too bad it was intended as present. Person I gave it to was overjoyed!

 

[KitchenCommander]

I happen to like western handles quite a bit. my favorite knife is a western grip, and one of the knives I use the least is a Shibata 210 gyuto with Wa handle that feels like I'm going to bend the tang just by cutting with it.

 

[Corradobrit1]

Yo>Wa w/machi>Wa
I like the control I have with a Yo or machi equipped Wa blade. A Yo with finger notch is just icing on the cake.

 

[labor of love]

I think some folks get caught up in the aesthetics when designing their western handles, overlooking the function and in-hand-feel

What’s funny is that @HSC /// Knives liked this comment and his handles were the first thing I thought of when I read this.

 

[HSC /// Knives]

What’s funny is that @HSC /// Knives liked this comment and his handles were the first thing I thought of when I read this.

I’ve tried a few different styles but can’t do better than my friend Tim Wright’s handle so I have settled on using his design.

Makers have to innovate and try different styles to distinguish themselves and so you get sharp corners and uncomfortable features. But that would be for the unpopular opinions thread

 

[captaincaed]

Hey I recognize that handle, darn nice I have to say.

I’ve tried a few different styles but can’t do better than my friend Tim Wright’s handle so I have settled on using his design.

Makers have to innovate and try different styles to distinguish themselves and so you get sharp corners and uncomfortable features. But that would be for the unpopular opinions thread

 

[Barmoley]

I have Harbeer's knife with a similar western handle and it is very comfortable in all the grips I use. It is a shorter, all purpose cooking knife for me, travel, camping, home, etc, and I've even given it to normies and they liked it as well.