Cheapish Suji for the Occasional Big Cut

[SwampDonkey]

Forgive me for not filling out the whole questionnaire but y'all mostly know where I fall by now anyway; wa handle, carbon welcome (even preferred), sharpened on stones, only the finest-smelling teak boards.

I want a ~270 mm sujihiki I can use for carving up big hunks o' meat and press in to duty as a sashimi knife (drunk home use only). I require the greater knowledge of this thread because I don't fully understand how grind interacts with different protein/meat textures. I've played with enough to know exactly what I want for vegetable knives but when it comes to slicing proteins, my collection tends to get turned on its head.

My Munetoshi 240 gyuto is my best meat knife, I'd buy a 270 suji in a heartbeat if I could find one. My first instinct is to go for an Enjin (Kyohei Shindo) 270 but I've noticed that violently thin edge of his doesn't always translate well to good meat performance like it does on veggies.

Looking for under $200 as I won't use it very often and this is mainly a golden egg thing when I can totally make due with other knives already in my collection. Don't give me the "for just a little bit more you can get X" treatment as I really want to spend $150 and am factoring in the price creep of you heathens' suggestions.

 

[blokey]

Sakai Kikumori Nihonko, cheap carbon and works well, for stainless JCK Kagayaki basic.

 

[HumbleHomeCook]

Love my 240. An absolute mainstay for me.

https://bernalcutlery.com/collectio...kikumori-nihonkou-270mm-sujihiki-carbon-steel

 

[deltaplex]

Any preference on mono vs clad or handle type? New or used?

 

[SwampDonkey]

Any preference on mono vs clad or handle type? New or used?

I don't care about mono or clad, happy to have a used one. I prefer wa handle but am not opposed to western either.

 

[AT5760]

FWIW, I was in the same boat as you about 6 months ago. I ended up going with a custom, which is a bit above your price point. At that price point, I’d look hard at SK sujis like the one linked above.

 

[HumbleHomeCook]

At your upper price point and considering a wa preference, this would likely be my personal choice:

https://bernalcutlery.com/collectio...tadayoshi-270mm-sujihiki-aogami-1-oct-ho-horn
I've considered the 240 many times.

 

[HumbleHomeCook]

Carbon also has a few choices:

https://carbonknifeco.com/collectio...nding&filter.v.price.gte=&filter.v.price.lte=
There's a Tsunehisa 270 AS kurouchi on there that would really intrigue me. Tsunehisa makes a good knife.

 

[SwampDonkey]

Carbon also has a few choices:

https://carbonknifeco.com/collectio...nding&filter.v.price.gte=&filter.v.price.lte=
There's a Tsunehisa 270 AS kurouchi on there that would really intrigue me. Tsunehisa makes a good knife.

Yeah I've considered a Tsunehisa suji before, especially with RSK often rolling 20+% discount codes it'd be the most economical option

 

[samjj234]

I got the JNS Kaeru Suji.. I like it.

 

[HumbleHomeCook]

Something to consider is that the Sakai Kikomori does have an asymetriccal grind. Mine is definitely right biased and I like that when slicing. I'm not sure if the others are as well.

 

[Benuser]

The SKs I've handled all had a relatively coarse structure, which I see as an advantage when dealing with meat, both raw and cooked.

 

[mengwong]

And you get that sexy blue patina too.

My sujis include a Fujirawa FKH 270mm which has a bit of a bird’s beak at the tip, and a 335mm Apex Ultra from MSicard.

I cast my vote for the SK Nihonkou, which I have in 210mm gyuto and have had no complaints about. I think it would do great for you.

 

[mengwong]

Don't give me the "for just a little bit more you can get X" treatment as I really want to spend $150 and am factoring in the price creep of you heathens' suggestions.

For just $10 more you can get 300mm

$10 + edge guard + new knife roll, that is

 

[Jovidah]

It's relatively easy to find cheap sujisbwith weetern handles (Tojiro, Fujiwara, and all the other black pakkawood handled stuff). There's also the really cheap kanehide/masahiro bessaku butchering knives (they have gyutos and sujis in that line).
But wa handled sujis tend to play in a higher pricerange - though you might find some exceptions.

 

[SwampDonkey]

For just $10 more you can get 300mm

View attachment 247861

$10 + edge guard + new knife roll, that is

I think this is the ticket. More blade More better

 

[naptight]

My first instinct is to go for an Enjin (Kyohei Shindo) 270 but I've noticed that violently thin edge of his doesn't always translate well to good meat performance like it does on veggies.

Is this the consensus? I just got a Shindo and the value seems incredible to me since thin bte seems to be the universal goal. At least for knives in a home setting with careful users.

@SwampDonkey what did you end up with?

 

[daveb]

Here's an out of box suggestion.

How about a cimitar for your big proteins? You could hit your 150 mark easily with a Vnox genre and have a knife quite unlike any other in your kit. I break mine out at home or at catered events when I want some pizzazz.

Of course it would suck for sushi but that's another knife for another day.

 

[Qapla']

Are you righty?

If yes, what do you think of this?

https://www.chefknivestogo.com/kapssu27.html (It's at Chef Knives To Go.)

 

[Choppin]

@HumbleHomeCook @blokey how flexy are Kikumori Nihonkou sujis? I’m considering grabbing one at Bernal’s sale to use as a slicer

Love my 240. An absolute mainstay for me.

https://bernalcutlery.com/collectio...kikumori-nihonkou-270mm-sujihiki-carbon-steel

 

[HumbleHomeCook]

@HumbleHomeCook @blokey how flexy are Kikumori Nihonkou sujis? I’m considering grabbing one at Bernal’s sale to use as a slicer

My 240 flexes very little. It's a pretty stiff knife.

 

[SwampDonkey]

Is this the consensus? I just got a Shindo and the value seems incredible to me since thin bte seems to be the universal goal. At least for knives in a home setting with careful users.

@SwampDonkey what did you end up with?

I have a Shindo aogami #2 gyuto, bunka, and nakiri already. They're some of my favorite knives and just silly good cutters, comparable to knives 3x the price. I've tried all 3 on meat with underwhelming results since they're so good on vegetables and I hoped they'd be the same on steaks/pork with a crust. Great for sashimi/fish though, my Unshu Yukimitsu is the exact same in veggie monster and raw fish but meh on meats.

I'm super curious to see if his suji grind is different and works better for proteins. The convex grind on Munetoshi or even Wat Pro nakiri were nice on the meats, didn't matter that they weren't quite so thin BTE. My Makoto Ryusei is pretty nice too.

I ended up buying 2 more rectangles and 2 240s because I'm a moron and just stewing on the slicer till Thanksgiving

 

[Nemo]

In this pricepoint, you should have a look at Shiro Kamo kurochi. Mine is the AS "Shinko Selian" from KNS. The various other similar SK KU knives (such as the blue2 "Black Dragon") also seem well regarded although I caomment on whether they are the same grinds.

At least in the Shinko Selian, the gyutos are ground thin, with a flat (slightly concave) wide bevel. The Suji is ground thicker (middleweight) with a convex wide bevel.

 

[SwampDonkey]

In this pricepoint, you should have a look at Shiro Kamo kurochi. Mine is the AS "Shinko Selian" from KNS. The various other similar SK KU knives (such as the blue2 "Black Dragon") also seem well regarded although I caomment on whether they are the same grinds.

At least in the Shinko Selian, the gyutos are ground thin, with a flat (slightly concave) wide bevel. The Suji is ground thicker (middleweight) with a convex wide bevel.

Shiro Kamo has definitely been on my radar for this as well. I've had a couple of his gyutos and bunkas and like his work, particularly the Tora from cleancut. I'll say the Tora and Akuma are way thinner than the Shinko Seilan in my experience.

 

[Pie]

Ooooops

 

[Pie]

In the spirit of the thread, why not a troll killer sakimaru?

Just kidding. Hatsukokoro Kumokage Aogami Kurouchi Katsuo-Kiri Slicer 240mm

This would be my suggestion at the upper price point, once it comes back in stock.

 

[SwampDonkey]

In the spirit of the thread, why not a troll killer sakimaru?

Just kidding. Hatsukokoro Kumokage Aogami Kurouchi Katsuo-Kiri Slicer 240mm

This would be my suggestion at the upper price point, once it comes back in stock.

Well that's cool as hell