New Used MAC PRO Knife

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coxhaus

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I bought a used MAC PRO knife off eBay. I have several questions as I have never owned a MAC knife. Should I buff this knife before I sharpen it? I assume it is more carbon like than my Henckels and Wusthof knives. Should try to put a shine on the blade as I have a big buffer out in my shop. How hard is the steel and what grits should I use to sharpen it? I will use a Worksharp Ken Oinion sharpener. What grits do you use with a stone? Here is a picture and it should be here on Monday. Anything else I should know about MAC PRO knives?

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The Mac knives are stainless, so wont be rusting like a non-stainless steel. If you want to clean it, you can use some Flitz polish on a rag, or if the stains are extra stubborn, you can use Bar Keeper's Friend. I dont think you need to use a buffer unless you want to (I'm assuming a buffing wheel and not like a rotary buffer, which might be a bit dangerous).
 
No, it a Baldor 3/4 hp commercial buffer mounted on a stand.

So real stainless. It seems to show more discolor than my German Henckels and Wusthof knives. I assumed it had more carbon in the blade for making it sharper.
 
Even stainless will discolor, or even rust. Try flitz or BKF first. Then reassess after.
 
The steel was AUS8, heat treated to 60HRC, I have Fujiwara FKM before, using the same steel with lower heat treat.

IME it’s not fully stainless. I usually just rinse my Misono UX10(19c27 or ginsan) and leave it overnight without wiping and there’s no water mark on the blade, but FKM seems to be a little bit more reactive this way, the water mark stays in the blade, sometimes also see orange rust. if 13% chromium been completely stainless, then I’ll say AUS8 more liked 12% chromium instead of 14%.
 
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coxhaus said:
So real stainless. It seems to show more discolor than my German Henckels and Wusthof knives. I assumed it had more carbon in the blade for making it sharper.
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It does have more - if it is indeed AUS-8. AUS-8 has 0.75% carbon vs the 0.5% from the usual German steel.

Not going to comment on whether that does or doesn't make it sharper since there's a million more things coming into play there and I'm just going to look dumb even trying to scratch that topic. :)
Stainless is more a function of the amount of chromium - although that has caveats as well.

In that sense the way the name 'carbon steel' is used in most places - including here - can be somewhat misleading, since it doesn't necessarily mean it has more carbon than some potential stainless alternatives. In essence it's just used to mean 'non-stainless'.
And stainless can also be more of a .. fluent scale, with the amount of stain resistance depending upon the rest of the contents in the alloy, and the amount of chromium. And if you expose something to the wrong environment almost anything will eventually rust or discolor. It's stain-less, not stain-never. ;)
 
@coxhaus. I think you'll find that it's a low maintenance, forgiving blade that is pretty close to stainless. I get some minor water staining and very slight spot oxidation on my MAC pro mbk85 if i dont dry it all the way before storage, but it is hardly noticeable and easily removed with a fine rust eraser.

As others have said, it's AUS8 at about 60hrc. Fairly thin grind. Could use maybe some light thinning behind the edge to make it "sing," but I wouldn't try too crazy of a geometry - especially not without a microbevel. The edge will chip/tear if you take it down real low without a microbevel.

But at sane geometries it's a very dependable performer and it'll knock your production German knives out of the water.

And when you're ready to upgrade without breaking the bank, i suggest something like the tojiro r2.

Enjoy 😁
 
So, I received the MAC PRO knife. It needs a little work but seems in nice shape.

My first impression is the handle is too short. It is uncomfortable in my hand the turned down part is sticking me. I could use it but not for very long. I have a comparison next to my recent Henckels 4star knife that I like. I think it will fit my wife as she has smaller hands. I will fix it up nice for her.

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coxhaus said:
So, I received the MAC PRO knife. It needs a little work but seems in nice shape.

My first impression is the handle is too short. It is uncomfortable in my hand the turned down part is sticking me. I could use it but not for very long. I have a comparison next to my recent Henckels 4star knife that I like. I think it will fit my wife as she has smaller hands. I will fix it up nice for her.

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How many fingers do you have wrapped around the handle? Usually I have 3 fingers (middle, ring, pinky) wrapped around the handle, and thumb+index fingers pinching the blade. And my middle finger is all the way up front, very close to or touching the choil, depending on the knife.
 
I have been using a knife for 50 years, I am not going to change now. If I was to change now it would through me off using a 10-inch knife. I will not start over. I have already learned how to use a knife over the last 50 years. The knife needs to fit me.
 
I hold all kinds of knives all kinds of ways. The idea that you can only do something the one single way you've been doing it for five decades isn't the kind of mentality that is likely to improve your skills or your appreciation of what makes one knife better than another.

"I am not going to change" "I have already learned how to use a knife." "It would throw me off using another knife." The problem is that you only learned one way to hold one knife; that isn't the same thing as "learning to use a knife." Having the willingness to try new things - both new knives and new knife techniques - will broaden your knowledge, refine your preferences, and expand and strengthen your skillset. Maybe you don't want to do any of those things. But then I wonder why you'd spend so much time on this forum.
 
One important difference you'll notice is that the Mac is significantly thinner.
From the photo, it's clear how the Henckels has thickened from progressive sharpenings without thinning.
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The gradual thickening of the blade behind the edge is likely to be one of the limitations of the Ken Onion thingimajig you’ve mentioned elsewhere. You can almost certainly get the edge sharp enough to pass many a test, but it’ll tend to meet a bit of resistance when going through thicker product.

I suspect the reassuring heft of the 4-stars allows you to power through that wedginess without too much hardship, but it’d better to thin that thing out imo. It won’t feel any better with the passing of time.
 
How thick becomes the edge with repetaed sharpening on this small belt? The width of the bevel might be misleading. Just thinkink ...

The bevel looks like 3-4mm wide. Ootb 0,5mm thick edges benefit from a little convex to zero. And repeated sharpening makes the edge thicker. If Iam right Ken Onionon can improve a new german knife until it becomes thick behind the edge.

Now its about a worn and chipped Mac. It looks like never sharpened.
@coxhaus
Afaik Mac Pro is a good cutting knife. Would you mind to just sharpen the Mac, leaving the chips as they are? Then you can compare it to your other knives.
 
Starting to understand now why you prefer some 'heft' on your blades when they're thick behind the edge...
You'd be surprised how easy and more controllable it is to use a knife in a pinch grip, especially if it's properly thin behind the edge. There's a reason they teach it in culinary schools. Honestly very easy to adapt to.

On the MAC it's going to be a bit of a challenge to restore it; by the time you have the chips sharpened out it's likely to also be thick behind the edge, so you'd have to thin as you go.
 
I’m actually curious about how that Henckels cuts. I’ve seen and used some henckels that are 0.5 mm thick behind the edge but that edge in the picture looks like 2 mm thick. I’ll see if I can sharpen my bone cleaver which also uses x50 steel to resemble the experience. Maybe it’s not that bad…
 
So, I sharpened the MAC PRO to 6000 and stropped with my new leather belt for the WSKO. My wife cut my tomatoes this morning for my bagel and cream cheese. She likes the knife. yea. She now has her own knife slot to keep her knife in. I am very happy my wife will use a decent sized knife. No more 5 inches and smaller knives for everyday use for her.

The handle does not fit me so I will stay with my Henckels 10-inch chef's knife. Henckels knives are thick at the top of the knife but they taper down to the thin blade. They are not slab knives where the blade is the same thickness. My edge is thin, maybe not as thin as the MAC PRO but it seems to cut tomatoes just as well. I do have more heft to power through on the cut than the MAC PRO on really big stuff. Good or bad I don't know yet.

I ended up just sharpening the MAC PRO knife and the small chips are gone with only the big chip barely there now. It cuts well.

While I had the belts on, I sharpen one of my 2 Henckels 10-inch knives the same way as the MAC PRO. I want to compare my 2 Henckels 10-inch knives and see if I can tell a difference. The other Henckels 10-inch is only sharpened to 3000.
 
Sorry, but what's showing on your pictures of your Henckels isn't even remotely thin. A properly thinned knife doesn't need heft because it almost doesn't require any force to go through produce.
 
Can we see the edge on one of your Henckels 4Stars after it came off of your Worksharp Ken Onion?
 
The top one is the Henckels and the bottom one is the MAC PRO. And just to let you guys know this is a lot of work to sharpen like this. It takes twice as much time to sharpen this way. I hate sharpening.

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coxhaus said:
The top one is the Henckels and the bottom one is the MAC PRO. And just to let you guys know this is a lot of work to sharpen like this. It takes twice as much time to sharpen this way. I hate sharpening.

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You are right. The henckels doesn’t look too bad but the Mac is thicker than it should be. Given the same sharpening angle, the thicker it is behind the edge the wider the edge bevel will be.

A really thin edge looks like this. You can barely see the edge bevel.


 
I need a picture without the knife moving. It is too hard for me to tell anything on your movie the light is bad.
 
coxhaus said:
I need a picture without the knife moving. It is too hard for me to tell anything on your movie the light is bad.
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The lighting's fine. He's moving the knife so you can see the light 'catch' the bevel. This way, it's easier to see the bevel than with a still photograph. Watch the clip a few more times and you'll see what looks to be a very thin white hair at the edge--this is the bevel. The purpose of the clip is to give a sense of how thin a bevel can be--whether OOTB, as with the Takamura in the clip, or after thinning/maintenance on an older knife.
 
McMan said:
One important difference you'll notice is that the Mac is significantly thinner.
From the photo, it's clear how the Henckels has thickened from progressive sharpenings without thinning.
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Exactly. As a rule of thumb, I would aim for 0.2mm thickness above the bevel, 0.5mm at 5mm from there and 1mm at 10mm. This for a general purpose chef's knife. Expect soft stainless German knives to come considerably thicker already OOTB.
 
coxhaus said:
And just to let you guys know this is a lot of work to sharpen like this. It takes twice as much time to sharpen this way. I hate sharpening.
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What does “this way” mean? I’m assuming you don’t just mean it takes twice as much work to sharpen two knives. 😜
 
ian said:
What does “this way” mean? I’m assuming you don’t just mean it takes twice as much work to sharpen two knives. 😜
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He’s going up to 6000 grit on a belt and stropping. I suspect it’s not having any effect on typical CrMoV German steel once he gets past 1000 grit. I think P6000 sandpaper is equivalent to a 16k-30k stone or thereabouts?

Although the edges pictured above certainly don’t have the mirror polish I’d expect coming off 6k grit sandpaper 🤷‍♂️ Maybe belt ratings are different than sandpaper?
 
And he’s comparing that to what? Just doing the belt at 1k? Yea, idk if those belt ratings are different from mine, but 800 is already super fine for me. But I don’t actually sharpen on belts, just thin /polish etc…, so idk. The full bevel also might not be getting hit evenly, in which case you might not see the mirror.

@coxhaus, what do you hate about sharpening? Have you ever tried stones?
 
ian said:
What does “this way” mean? I’m assuming you don’t just mean it takes twice as much work to sharpen two knives. 😜
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More than likely, I won't use the extra belts normally for sharpening as I think it is not needed for cooking. I will stop at 3000. It is faster.

I can tell a difference between 1000 belts and 3000 belts so I will use the 3000.
 
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