The perfect bartender cocktail lemon knife

[mengwong]

Buddy of mine runs a whiskey bar. Tonight at his invitation I sharpened his generic 8” 1.4116 Granton-edge foodservice knife. After twenty minutes of rebeveling, the apex is now as good as it’s ever going to get, but behind the edge it’s still thick, the steel is still soft, and I’m not looking forward to thinning it.

Let’s just buy him a new knife, ja? I’ve known him since we were nine, friends like this don’t come along every day.

The only thing he cuts is lemons and limes behind the bar. Right handed, push cut, poly board.

I can drop by every few months for a drink and a touch up.

What’s the perfect knife for this situation? Stainless, at least stainless clad. JKI’s ginsanko wa-petties are all OOS or I would have clicked “buy” already. Is there something in the $200 range that bartenders swear by? I’d like it to be a nice gift. Needs to survive seeds and staff.

Edit: this Hitohira reseller is local, I can save on shipping if you recommend something in stock. Gyuto Knife | The Japanese Chef's Knife - Kitchin Tools

 

[pleue]

Takamura r2 180?

 

[daddy yo yo]

Takamura r2 180?

I’d take a 150 petty.

The question is, isn’t a Victorinox (or 20 of those) sufficient for that task? Or a Herder…

 

[mengwong]

I love Vics but the smooth steel sticks to the lemon slices. Hoping for something with better stiction for citrus specifically.

 

[Delat]

My wife’s been abusing this one for about a year and it’s held up great. It’s also what I reach for when I need to cut a lemon or lime, and goes right through seeds. Although I think something in the 150 - 180 range might be better if he has enough room for it. I believe these are rebranded Tsunehisa.

https://japanesechefsknife.com/coll...k-natures-gekko-kagami-petty-135mm-5-3-inch-1
Here’s the landing page with other sizes
https://japanesechefsknife.com/collections/gekko

 

[AT5760]

From you local store, this one may be a decent option. I have it in a 135mm and I think it would be really well suited for his tasks. The profile has a lot more belly than what most users here would prefer, but it may be a good compromise from what he is used to. On occasion my wife will use this knife on poly boards and leave it there. I've never noticed any corrosion or chipping.

https://kitchintools.com/en-us/collections/petty/products/aaa-030-24-ba150

 

[parbaked]

Ashi 180 stainless petty.
Comes with a saya.
Hard to find but Carbon has one…
https://carbonknifeco.com/collectio...ucts/ashi-ginga-stainless-western-petty-180mm

 

[M1k3]

If he's not abusive, I'd second the Takamura R2.

 

[daveb]

When I'm catering I'll frequently cut the bartenders fruit for them (safer and much more likely than loaning them a knife). I carry a 180 petty (various) or 180 gyuto (G Ginga, Wat) for the task. Something cheaper would prob work like Korin's 180 Susien Western Stainless - the important part is the 180 length.

 

[gentiscid]

Vg10 125-150 petty… Masutani or any other cheap brand.

 

[HumbleHomeCook]

I'd have to give strong consideration to a Mac Pro 6" petty.

A touch of asymmetry and not so expensive that if it gets damaged/lost/stolen that it'll hurt too bad.

It depends on the bar but obviously many of them can be quite busy and I can imagine a knife in this use case getting knocked about.
https://bernalcutlery.com/products/mac-6-petty-knife-professional-pkf-60?variant=40914384027800
If it is a more laid back, slower paced joint then...

My @MSicardCutlery AEB-L 165 petty cuts a good amount of citris.

 

[Benuser]

A 180mm petty, stainless. The shorter the blade, the smaller the contact area with the board, with a poor edge retention as a result.
This one has nothing spectacular, will do the job, doesn't look too fancy. Requires a good stone sharpening out of the box. Surprising easy sharpening, by the way. Has a good bite that will survive poly boards.
https://japanesechefsknife.com/products/misono-440-series-slicer-knife

 

[stringer]

I have carried a 150mm Kanehide TK petty in my knife kit for many years for the sole purpose to loan out to bartenders who ask me for a knife to slice citrus with. It has received many compliments.

 

[daddy yo yo]

Misono UX10?

 

[pleue]

I like knuckle clearance when running through a bunch of product. Sounds like he's used to a chef knife though I may be wrong. Guessing he also cuts oranges/grapefruits/the occasional other garnish unless they're a hyper specific bar. Whatever lives there will get tipped quickly I'd imagine. Most bartenders use a serrated vic parer in my experience so I was a bit surprised he leaned chef knife, hence the gyuto over petty rec.

 

[chefwp]

I see a lot of folks are recommending smaller knives. I totally get it, if I worked in any of the bars I was familiar with, abusive places for knives to be sure, I'd also want something smaller, I'd probably go for this: Wusthof Grand Prix II 5-Inch Hollow-Edge Santoku Knife after I chipped my Yaxell petty on a lemon seed or tipped it during some chaos.

Maybe i'm totally off base though, does he ever use this knife during service, or does it only come out for prep before service and then get tucked away to a safe place? That might make a huge difference in my choice.

but enough about me... How does your buddy feel, does he want to stay with the size and shape he is familiar with, 8" chef?

 

[chefwp]

I have carried a 150mm Kanehide TK petty in my knife kit for many years for the sole purpose to loan out to bartenders who ask me for a knife to slice citrus with. It has received many compliments.

After explaining all I could briefly I recently recommended some options to a friend of mine looking for a new chefs knife, with a Kanehide TK gyuto as my top pick for him. He got it and is over the moon about it, so I'd have to say this is a solid choice, and if @mengwong's buddy wants to stay in his 'size of familiarity' the 210mm gyuto might be an option here as well.

 

[stringer]

After explaining all I could briefly I recently recommended some options to a friend of mine looking for a new chefs knife, with a Kanehide TK gyuto as my top pick for him. He got it and is over the moon about it, so I'd have to say this is a solid choice, and if @mengwong's buddy wants to stay in his 'size of familiarity' the 210mm gyuto might be an option here as well.

I am on my third Kanehide gyuto. No nonsense professional equipment. I have also owned over the years a couple of petties, a hankotsu, and a honesuki. I buy them when I need them for a particular task at work and I've never been disappointed.

 

[Pisau]

Ooh this is fun. If I were to cut citrus in front of a bunch of tipsy Ah Bengs:

Glestain offset petty (140mm) ... flashy

Kono hd2 petty 150mm

Nenohi custom? super flashy $$$

Misono UX10 boning has a useful tip and thin 145mm

And if they ask about the knife, get your buddy sell some on the side

 

[HumbleHomeCook]

This is in BST right now:

https://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/...eed-to-sell—-price-reduced.62911/#post-963429
Maybe a touch shorter than most of us recommended but still a step up from a Vic paring knife for sure.

 

[btbyrd]

Watching this thread as well. My only 150 petty is iron clad aogami super, which makes it non-ideal for acidic ingredients. I have a Misono UX10 120mm petty, which is nice but is short for larger citrus. I've been considering a Takamura Chromax 130 because I like the aesthetic and it's relatively inexpensive for the quality. I guess there's always the R2 150...

 

[Jovidah]

Not speaking from experience here, but considering Larrin Thomas's testing about the cumulative effect on edge retention of acids... if a knife is going to be dipped in lemon all day I'd lean very much towards something that excels in corrosion resistance. For me that'd rule out the semi-stainless stuff (regardless of how much of a fan I am of the utlitarian semi-stainless stuff).

 

[btbyrd]

I was thinking more for my own personal use case, which would involve the occasional lemon rather than the all day juice-bath that bartenders contend with.

 

[cawilson6072]

Butch Harner Parer or Steak. The belly on these is really nice for board work while being right sized for the hand. I have the steak knife and reach for it ALL the time. Harner's handle shape and heft is so very nice in-hand. Quintin Middleton's Echo parer seems like something in the same design range, but I have not tried his parer personally (though I have had the Pappy barrel stave handled version in my shopping cart a couple of times when thinking of buying myself a present).

 

[jaydee]

If he had an 8" before and push cuts, id get a 180mm gyuto or anything up to 8".
A petty would be a totally different knife, much shorter and less height. Does he pinch-grip? Hard to do with most pettys on the board.
Most cocktail bars use cucumber etc. and herbs too, right. More reasons for a small gyuto.

A MAC or other cheaper molybdenum steel knife could be a durable solution with slightly softer steel than "we" like.
Can very quickly be brought back to life with all sorts of abrasives.

 

[demcav]

How about a Glestain offset utility knife:
210mm, excellent food release, knuckle clearance, and stainless. One caveat, however, is less-than-stellar edge retention.

Glestain 210mm Offset Utility Knife | knifemerchant.com

 

[Dan-]

Not speaking from experience here, but considering Larrin Thomas's testing about the cumulative effect on edge retention of acids... if a knife is going to be dipped in lemon all day I'd lean very much towards something that excels in corrosion resistance. For me that'd rule out the semi-stainless stuff (regardless of how much of a fan I am of the utlitarian semi-stainless stuff).

The other consideration is a geometry that will still cut even after bathing in citric acid all day. I used to use (at home) a Wusthof 6” GP chefs knife for this, and while it would get super dull, because not much washing going when margaritas are to be had, I could still force it through a lime. I now use a 165 SG2 petty, and the lack of height means I have sometimes have to work at it. (And be more conscientious)

 

[ethompson]

Seems like a great excuse to have a 195 gyutohiki is AEBL or Magnacut and a little nanohone diamond "strop"

 

[jedy617]

I use a miyabi birchwood sg2 petty

 

[HumbleHomeCook]

Sorry, I completely spaced that he currently uses an 8" knife.